You have it the wrong way around with natural vs artificial immunity.
That's what the recently reported Israeli study has shown.
And this shit is why "zero covid" strategies of all sorts are futile, causing economic and other forms of damage to prevent locally something that will happen in the world anyway and then spread everywhere. As there already were attempts to stop variant spread. They have all failed.
If that kind of mutation is possible naturally, it most likely is going to happen due to the sheer scale of already existing virus spread, and few hundred million unvaccinated in western world are far less likely to incubate it than the few billions of remaining people who are either unvaccinated or vaccinated with the according to all reports much crappier Chinese, Russian and other incoming vaccine variants of questionable effectiveness.
So its basically creating a significant legal, political and cultural precedent in our societies, probably for worse, for an effect that's going to marginal few percent at most in the grand scheme of things.
Don't forget clinically retarded.Yeah, you're authoritarian loon. Are you Australian or something?
Don't forget clinically retarded.
Open VAERS
The VAERS report is from the CDC reporting adverse reactions from the vaccine
My bad, it's HHS, not the CDC.
That in no way contradicts the other study. Natural immunity still looks good even compared to boosted vaccine, even if boosted works better than two shot.Israel finds COVID-19 vaccine booster significantly lowers infection risk
A third dose of Pfizer 's COVID-19 vaccine has significantly improved protection from infection and serious illness among people aged 60 and older in Israel compared with those who received two shots, findings published by the Health Ministry showed on Sunday.www.reuters.com
Consider other countries. Even New Zealand, infamous for being extreme in their COVID reactions, already has delta outbreaks.Yes, because our government refuses to impose strict border protection. They're fucking retarded.
That's not how virus mutations work. Weather affects spread the most, which is something the virus is evolving for either way. As far as random mutations go, those are randomly spawned with sufficient number of replications, which means cases, followed by evolutionary pressures of dealing with all types of spread challenges and competing in survival with non mutant and other successful mutant variants, including but not limited to weather. In a way, vaccines are also an obstacle which the virus is evolving to counter.Russia is not likely to generate something nasty. Very cold with very short summers. Tropical and subtropical regions however, are much more likely to generate this sort of thing. So China, India, Brazil, and the United States are all major danger zones for producing more and more strains. That doesn't mean they will be dangerous, but they most certainly can be.
If at all, that's a great idea against socialized healthcare. If the choice is healthcare tyranny reaching further into private lives than anything before or letting the market decide, i think many would pick the latter.Oh, I personally think they have the right idea. The government needs to just take it one extra step. Start stripping away free healthcare and benefits to those who choose to be unhealthy. Morbidly obese? No reason why any of us should have to pay for that choice. Smoke like a chimney? We shouldn't have to pay for their lung cancer. Drink like a fish? Good luck after you crash your car and break half the bones in your body. Drugs? Not our problem.
People don't want to take care of themselves? Fine, that's their God-given-choice. But then don't expect the rest of us to give hand outs to them.
History
Let's see here, you think people exercising their rights are being inherently selfish and should be punished for it.
You sound pretty brainwashed to me! Also the dig at info wars viewers is adorable. Turns out they're more informed than most of us who spent a decade criticizing them thought.
A potential nightmare scenario. Unless you concede this is a bioweapon that was deliberately deployed then there's no reason for it to do something those bugs have never done.
All of it dude, all of it.
The totality of everything. You are wrong on all accounts.
Do you? You seem perfectly willing to endorse the disenfranchisement of tens of millions of Americans in a retaliatory measure to castigate them for using their own judgment.
That's rather un-American of you and far more in line with the seditious accusations levied against the more right leaning userbase by the prior staff during their Jan 6th chimp out than anything was actually said by anyone.
Oh Jesus it's at a million and a half now? I thought it was still in the tens of thousands for reports.
Deathtolls up too!
Yeah we need army doctors shoving this in our arms Ns the loss of our rights and freedoms and to be murdered by hospital administrators over this. Totally.
So you have absolutely nothing to support your belief.
And twitter exercised their right to ban people from their platform, despite their social responsibility to allow others to speak their mind. Do you think they should be punished?
If it wasn't a bioweapon, I can bet that the Chinese are working on one now. You've all proven that so long as they can provide plausible deniability to having been the ones to release it, then they can release a non-lethal bioweapon similar to COVID and about 40% of the US's population will refuse to get a vaccine.
You're encouraging bioweapons aimed for use in economic warfare.
Why should your health insurance pay for something that you can easily avoid?
I was also willing to let 38.4 million Afghans suffer the return of the Taliban to power. I was also willing to 39.31 million Iraqis suffer under the tender mercies of ISIS. I was also willing to 17.07 million Syrians suffer the horrors of a prolonged civil war. I am fully willing to enact soul crushing economic warfare against China, which will plunge some 1.398 billion Chinese into a hellscape of poverty and oppression.
Do you think I'm at all bothered that we'd strip away health benefits from ~100 million Americans because they don't want to get a shot? I mean, if you think the government is doing something shady with fucking vaccines, why would you trust them with your healthcare? Or anything?
No, it's very American of me. It's very Yankee-American.
Assuming this is for America only? And that the data is reliable? That's a death rate of .02%, whereas if it's world-wide .0015%
Even if you include all the vaccine related injuries, in the US it would be about 1.5% and if it's world-wide, 0.07%.
This is your argument for NOT getting a vaccine shot?
So you have absolutely nothing to support your belief.
]And twitter exercised their right to ban people from their platform, despite their social responsibility to allow others to speak their mind. Do you think they should be punished?
really don't give two shits about infowars dude.
]
If it wasn't a bioweapon, I can bet that the Chinese are working on one now. You've all proven that so long as they can provide plausible deniability to having been the ones to release it, then they can release a non-lethal bioweapon similar to COVID and about 40% of the US's population will refuse to get a vaccine
You're encouraging bioweapons aimed for use in economic warfare.
Why should your health insurance pay for something that you can easily avoid?
was also willing to let 38.4 million Afghans suffer the return of the Taliban to power. I was also willing to 39.31 million Iraqis suffer under the tender mercies of ISIS. I was also willing to 17.07 million Syrians suffer the horrors of a prolonged civil war. I am fully willing to enact soul crushing economic warfare against China, which will plunge some 1.398 billion Chinese into a hellscape of poverty and oppression.
Do you think I'm at all bothered that we'd strip away health benefits from ~100 million Americans because they don't want to get a shot? I mean, if you think the government is doing something shady with fucking vaccines, why would you trust them with your healthcare? Or anything?
No, it's very American of me. It's very Yankee-American.
This is your argument for NOT getting a vaccine shot?
New argument: We don't want the vaccine because it's people like YOU demanding we get it. And if you go that insane with power and demands of compliance over a vaccine "for our own safety" Christ help us when you decide we are the enemy for some reason.
That in no way contradicts the other study. Natural immunity still looks good even compared to boosted vaccine, even if boosted works better than two shot.
Consider other countries. Even New Zealand, infamous for being extreme in their COVID reactions, already has delta outbreaks.
Same goes for Australia.
Even for North Korea and other dictatorships that took border protection seriously even before it was cool.
The fact that USA does such a pressure campaign despite not taking border protection seriously is just evidence of what isn't the primary motivation in this.
That's not how virus mutations work. Weather affects spread the most, which is something the virus is evolving for either way. As far as random mutations go, those are randomly spawned with sufficient number of replications, which means cases, followed by evolutionary pressures of dealing with all types of spread challenges and competing in survival with non mutant and other successful mutant variants, including but not limited to weather. In a way, vaccines are also an obstacle which the virus is evolving to counter.
Either way, its a whole lot of countries with a whole lot of population standing ready to generate the black swan variant. If it is possible for it occur naturally, chances are its going to do it there either way, regardless of how heavy handed US and EU get towards their own citizens in getting their vaccination rates to some bureaucratically convenient line of 80% or 90%.
If at all, that's a great idea against socialized healthcare. If the choice is healthcare tyranny reaching further into private lives than anything before or letting the market decide, i think many would pick the latter.
You know damn well that several of the areas of "healthcare controversies" you have listed out are more politically controversial than others, and some are also more big pharma appealing than others, so any such hypothetical heavy handed healthcare system would have, by all chance, the lines set according the political and financial needs of the above, rather than any kind of sanity or sense.
And even if by some magical means it was guaranteed to be done in a sensible, non-corrupt, and ideologically unbiased way, it would still mandate an open discussion about the implication this has for the relationship between government and citizens, and whether the government should proceed with that step anyway on that account.
Just all of recorded human history...you dishonest butcher
Yes I do, for supporting the overthrow of the US Governent and the installation of a Vichy regime.
For profiting off of and encouraging child rape, for running pedo acceptance and self harm hashtags.
Nor do I yet most people get their advice from there now and it's informing policy.
Oh and sometimes they're right.
The vaccine created by and championed by the people who helped create the virus itself?
So its what @sir_fire Says. You aren't evil just mentally retarded.
Because its illegal to use any form of coercion to force people to take unreliable and experimental medicine genius.
It's unconstitutional and it's a violation of international law as well.
Wait whose flexing now? None of this has anything to do with American citizens.
Unless you're saying American citizens are no different than foreigners? In which case....looool
I expected you to be loyal if you were an American.
I guess that was asking to much. Either you're not American in which case you've no right to dictate anything to us or you're a blood traitor.
If yiur excuse is "well Lincoln, FDR and LBJ raped the Republic so it's okay" I uhh...well it's more proof that the mentality of the New England region is a threat to the Repiblic I guess.
No, my argument is that mandating vaccines by any means is a violation of the constitution and that doing it for behavioral engineering reasons goes into terrorism and treason.
Ultimately we will know for absolutely sure whether there are good reasons to not get the vaccine in 20-30 years. No sooner, no later.Your study isn't at all conclusive.
Protection against Delta: Comparing vaccines and natural immunity
Researchers in Israel have compared the relatively long-term protection of natural immunity with that acquired from a COVID-19 vaccine.www.medicalnewstoday.com
Nor does anyone seem to recommend that this is a good reason not to get the vaccinations.
If it was one country, you would have a had a good point. If it was several countries, you would still have a good point. But apparently no country in the whole fucking world, rich or poor, democratic or authoritarian, can muster up enough border controls to stop the delta variant. Conclusion being, its either ridiculously hard or downright impossible. In turn raising a huge question of whether trying is worth the effort.North Korea is a joke.
And no, if a virus is getting in through our water borders, then you are not doing a good job in imposing strong border controls.
How does that create an environment with an evolutionary pressure for making the virus deadlier?Except you're providing an environment that seems to make the virus deadlier, as was the case in India and Brazil.
Most? I'd suggest checking either your eyesight or your math skills.Most of the things being taken away in those proposed Biden orders is taking away public healthcare.
Which is exactly why they won't be the ones targeted. They are allowed to have such generous public benefits of all sorts in the first place because it is politically correct for that to be the case. Democrats and their friends most certainly are not libertarians tied by overly generous socialist welfare, looking for any excuse to push through libertarian reforms to healthcare by hook or by crook.Are they? Because I see sacks of shit of every color exploiting food stamps, welfare, AND medical assistance so they can sit on their fat, worthless asses and pop pills all day. You think I give two shits if they lose their healthcare because they won't get vaccinated? Fuck that and fuck them. Most of my friends and family had to work through this pandemic, myself included. I didn't run to Papa Government the moment I had the chance to get free cash.
The black death and spanish flu are coronaviruses like Covid? You retard....Like the those plagues that wiped out Europe's population? Are you mental?
By freeing them and doing nothing else, duh. How would you react if all of a sudden there were a million-plus homeless, jobless people? Probably really stupidly and in a short-sighted manner.How did Lincoln rape the country by freeing the slaves?
Say it straight to me then retard.Who gives a shit what sir_fire thinks? He's sitting on the sidelines screaming insults like a little bitch.
But that's the death rate for the virus itself you retard.I expected my fellow Americans wouldn't be such pathetic bitches that they couldn't take a risk of dying is at best, .02%.
You mean the same society that shuns people for not taking the vaccine and not looking the other way whenever a member of the LGBT or other protected classes does criminal acts? And the very same corporations who silence and disenfranchise those very same people who refuse to get in with the program? Keep your crummy society and keep licking the boots of your corporate overlords retard, but don't tout your slavery as a virtue.We're not talking about any other alleged crimes. We're talking about their social crimes. Because those companies have every right to ban people they don't like from their platform. Those internet providers have every right to cut off access they don't like. And those credit card companies have the right to stop payments through their networks. For pretty much any reason at all.
And yet you screamed and stamped your feet, each and every time. What happened to the free market? Do you not expect any sort of social obligation to society that values free and honest speech?
And yet North Korea is harder to get into than places like Australia and New Zealand? Despite them having the harshest lockdown and vaccine enforcement policies, the kind that you'd soymouth over and say is a good example of how to handle this terrible, horrible and lethal virus that only kills the severely unhealthy and old and has a 2% fatality rate.North Korea is a joke.
And no, if a virus is getting in through our water borders, then you are not doing a good job in imposing strong border controls.
"I'll take something that didn't happen for $800 Alex!"Are they? Because I see sacks of shit of every color exploiting food stamps, welfare, AND medical assistance so they can sit on their fat, worthless asses and pop pills all day. You think I give two shits if they lose their healthcare because they won't get vaccinated? Fuck that and fuck them. Most of my friends and family had to work through this pandemic, myself included. I didn't run to Papa Government the moment I had the chance to get free cash.
Did you actually check the deaths there or are you just basing this solely off of the number of infected like the retard that you are?Except you're providing an environment that seems to make the virus deadlier, as was the case in India and Brazil.
...Like the those plagues that wiped out Europe's population? Are you mental?
We're not talking about any other alleged crimes. We're talking about their social crimes. Because those companies have every right to ban people they don't like from their platform. Those internet providers have every right to cut off access they don't like. And those credit card companies have the right to stop payments through their networks. For pretty much any reason at all.
And yet you screamed and stamped your feet, each and every time. What happened to the free market? Do you not expect any sort of social obligation to society that values free and honest speech?
Again, what does that have to do with...anything? You can get two uneducated dipshits with no idea what they're doing saying "This will get better" or "This will get worse" and one will end up being right.
...You're accusing Moderna, Phizer, and J&J of helping to of created the Wuhan virus?
.They're all American multinationals. The closest is J&J's vaccine, the company which produced it being headquartered in Belgium
.Who gives a shit what sir_fire thinks? He's sitting on the sidelines screaming insults like a little bitch
.How is it unreliable? Almost 200 million Americans have gotten the shot and the best you jokers can come up with was a site that claims 1.5 million in "vaccine injuries". If that's JUST the USA, then we're talking about an injury rate at around 1.5%. Your chances of absolutely nothing bad happening to you is 97.5%
.]Did I say that? No. I said that after all that, do you think I'm going to be bothered about forcing a few people to get a shot so harmless, that your chances of something bad happening is 1.5% or less? Yeah, I'm not that bothered. And we don't even know if everything on that list will come out. That's a leek with no reliability whatsoever
I expected my fellow Americans wouldn't be such pathetic bitches that they couldn't take a risk of dying is at best, .02%.
Yes, that's right, I'm the traitor.
I took the 1.5% risk for myself and the rest of the country without batting an eye
You on the other hand, think you're profoundly brave.
How did Lincoln rape the country by freeing the slaves?
But your risk of injury is 1.5%. At worst. If that site is using globally sourced data, then chance of injury is .07%.
Why is this the hill you want to die on?
You have moved the goalpost back to "but the vaxx is safe!" ignoring that the point is it doesn't look useful and we don't want it in our bodies because of that. Especially against such a joke of a virus.
Also, he mentions Lincoln raped the Republic because of the suspension of Habeas Corpus he had during the Civil War. Really bad thing, was worth in the end but really bad.
You have moved the goalpost back to "but the vaxx is safe!" ignoring that the point is it doesn't look useful and we don't want it in our bodies because of that. Especially against such a joke of a virus.
Also, he mentions Lincoln raped the Republic because of the suspension of Habeas Corpus he had during the Civil War. Really bad thing, was worth in the end but really bad.