Istanbul/Constantinople could have been even larger right now had the Ottoman Empire survived up to the present-day and kept all of is 1914 territory, no? Heck, in such a scenario, the Ottoman Empire could have eventually expanded into some or all of the Arabian Peninsula.
Cities that could've been or could have been even greater
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Skallagrim
Well-known member
Yup. This would generally presuppose a "no world wars" scenario, or at least one in which the Ottomans stay out (or side with the winners). This gives them enough breathing room for oil to be found, and then they're set.
Yep, absolutely. Also, both Vienna and Budapest could have likewise been larger had they remained the capitals of larger countries. In such a scenario, we could see, say, Galician Poles, Ukrainians, and Jews move to Vienna in large numbers while Slovaks, Ruthenians, Romanians, Serbs, Banat Germans, Jews, and Croats move to Budapest in large numbers.
I'm rather fascinated with the potential of the Kingdom of Hungary/Budapest had they not been defeated at Mohacs by the Turks. They actually conquered Vienna at one point and basically forced the HRE out of meddling in their affairs. If Matthais Corvinus had lived longer and had an heir that he was able to get ready in time to rule Hungary, they might have remained the superpower of the era for generations more and the Black Army could have been maintained, which would have likely enabled them to hold off the Ottomans the following century. Like most Kingdoms/Empire that fall it was the collapse of centralized power after the death of a strong king (in this case due to lack of a legitimate heir) and the rise of the nobility which led to the dissolution of the standing army (which was the king's main powerbase) and crippling of the kingdom for their own selfish desires for power.
It is mindboggling how stupid and venal the nobility in Hungary was throughout the centuries, all because they didn't want a strong king who would crush dissent among them:
Battle of Mohács - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
I wonder if we can draw any modern parallels....
Anyway in terms of a Hungary superpower that remains powerful it would dominate the Balkans, Bohemia, parts of all of Austria, and even parts of Silesia. They also intermarried with the Polish, so assuming that state dissolves roughly per OTL Hungary would get all that. They'd basically be the early Habsburg empire without most of the pesky HRE issues and German nationalism problems and vastly more centralized and modern as a result. Their biggest strength for quite some time was their surprisingly modern bureaucracy and taxation system, as well as professional standing army, which was a novelty in that era.
A Hungary that defeats the Ottomans and turns them into the 'sick man of Europe' a few hundred years earlier would change all of European history, probably for the better if the Habsburgs didn't extend themselves into Hungary (as a result of the battle of Mohacs specifically). It would also ensure the Hungary is set up to be one of the great powers of Europe, maybe on par with France of that era, would shield the HRE from the threats from the Balkans (woe be to France and Poland and probably the HRE peoples themselves given the religious wars of the period), and if it could politically modernize with the times by the 20th century might well be a colonial power in the region like Venice was at one point, conquer Istanbul/Constantinople, and become one of the first oil states thanks to controlling what would be modern Romania, the Vienna basin, and Galicia.
Considering the resources of the region if united in one political entity (and assuming it isn't torn apart by ethnic movements like the Habsburg empire was, which certainly could have been avoided if a centralized Hungarian state was able to push culture and language on the empire the way Paris did on what became France. France being of course a multi-ethnic/linguistic state until the various region had the concept of 'France' and Parisian language imposed on them) it could be a massive industrial power, potentially greater than Imperial Germany if Budapest was the one selling oil to them. It would be rather interesting if Budapest was the senior partner in a relationship with whatever state exists in German Europe.
Budapest would then be an imperial capital on par with if not greater even than OTL Habsburg Vienna, Berlin, Paris, St. Petersburg, or London. It would be interesting to see if they ally with Berlin (assuming that is the German/HRE capital), Paris, or St. Petersburg. Certainly a Budapest-Baghdad railroad would make for an interesting ATL and one that might have even been possible in the 19th century depending on political/military developments.
In this TL, could we see an eventual Hungarian-Russian race to pick up the remnants of the Ottoman Empire, with the Hungarians and Russians being rivals and possibly even enemies over this? If the Hungarians have a powerful navy, I could imagine them courting the Maronite Catholics in Lebanon since Hungarians are likewise Catholic.
Relations between Hungary and Italy are going to be interesting. Will Hungary attempt to exert influence in Italian politics and affairs similar to what France did in the late 15th and 16th centuries in real life with the Italian Wars? And with a PoD that far back, it's possible that German and/or Italian unification as we know it won't occur, though if it does, I could imagine both of these countries being loyal Hungarian allies.
I could also see an infusion of Greek culture into Hungary if Hungary will have ambitions to eventually annex and incorporate Greece into its vast empire or at least make Greece a puppet state. A fusion Hungaro-Greek culture would certainly be extremely interesting. Goulash with feta cheese and olives, anyone?
Cities in the more developed and prosperous parts of empires that got significantly shrunken over the last century or two have certainly been made worse off. This is also true for Anatolian cities had the Ottoman Empire not broken up and collapsed, for Indian cities had India not been partitioned (Delhi would have been larger, at least, I think), for European Russian cities had Russia avoided losing its peripheral territories and also avoided its extreme 20th century demographic devastation. We could have seen St. Petersburg, Moscow, Kiev, Odessa, et cetera all be much larger right now.
I suppose that had Japan actually succeeded in achieving the Greater East Asia Co-Prosperity Sphere and subsequently significantly loosened its immigration policy, then Japanese cities, including Tokyo, could have been much larger in size right now due to the huge influx of Korean, Manchurian, and especially Chinese settlers into Japanese cities. Interestingly enough, this might also help fuel the development of a mixed East Asian super-race that will aim to eventually dominate the world!
Sergeant Foley
Well-known member
Austin, Texas is one the verge of having the worst homeless crisis and the violent crime down there is awful
Huh; you're right:
One year after voters reinstated the camping ban, Austin's homelessness woes continue
It's been a year since the public camping ban was reinstated and, as a result, tents are a less common sight in Downtown Austin. Yet the issue still remains.
www.kvue.com
As for violent crime, blame liberals' fetishism for violent criminals, especially black ones. This has its roots in the Noble Savage concept of the Enlightenment:
Noble savage - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
Ever notice that the people who believe the noble savage myth are the ones who never actually had to deal with savages?Huh; you're right:
One year after voters reinstated the camping ban, Austin's homelessness woes continue
It's been a year since the public camping ban was reinstated and, as a result, tents are a less common sight in Downtown Austin. Yet the issue still remains.
As for violent crime, blame liberals' fetishism for violent criminals, especially black ones. This has its roots in the Noble Savage concept of the Enlightenment:
Noble savage - Wikipedia
Yep, very true. It might be similar to how wealthy elites pushed for school busing back in the 1970s while of course ensuring that their own kids went to fancy private schools where the diversity was cherry-picked.
William Faulkner, meanwhile, opposed both forced segregation and forced integration. TBH, I think that a lot of people opposed forced integration past a certain point.
Sergeant Foley
Well-known member
Yet Faulkner cannot nag since the country is INTEGRATED fully.
49ersfootball
Well-known member
Atlanta, GA is suffering from an increasing homeless crisis according to one of my college classmates.
I wouldn't necessarily say integrated fully since de facto (as opposed to de jure) residential segregation is still widespread even right now since whites, other than gentrifiers, generally don't want to live in heavily black areas. Hence things such as white flight:
Sergeant Foley
Well-known member
Explains why Houston is having similar issues
A lot of large US cities, frankly.
Sergeant Foley
Well-known member
Isn't Atlanta having similar problems with gentrification? I've heard Buckhead got the greenlight from the Republican-controlled Georgia General Assembly to become a city.
You get bitched at for gentrification and you get bitched at for white flight.
The conclusion they want your money but they don't want you, which as a jewish man I'm unfortantly very used to.
Had the KMT won the Chinese Civil War while the Chinese Communists would have managed to maintain a rump state in Manchuria, whatever city is chosen to be Manchuria's capital could end up being bigger, perhaps even significantly bigger, than it ended up being in real life since it would become the center of gravity for Manchuria and its 100+ million people and also since Manchuria is highly unlikely to allow emigration to KMT-led China.
Had Poland succeeded in restoring its 1772 borders after the end of WWI and in permanently sustaining this arrangement afterwards, cities in western Poland such as Warsaw, Lodz, and Krakow could have had a significantly larger population right now due to the fact that there could have been a lot of Ukrainian and Belarusian migration from eastern Poland into these more developed and likely wealthier western Polish cities.
Germany failed to see that Poland was a useful Buffer state that kept the Russian bear away. They suffered years of partial occupation much of it brutal for doing so.