Oklahoma Still Half Reservation, SCOTUS Rules

[Bacle]

I wonder if a similar situation might be applied to other states with large Native populations, like Alaska or New Mexico. Were other reservations/native land trusts improperly dissolved?

Considering just how abusive how many tribal governments are and how many people have abused the difference in jurisdiction to prey upon natives. I honestly think the best thing to do is dissolve all of the reservations. Make them into cities and counties and give said natives full representation that would imply.

No, just do what they did with the Natives in Alaska; incorporate the tribes as tribal corporations, instead of as local govs.

Makes the laws governing thier land far harder to abuse, because land then becomes a private corporate property, not a separate jurisdiction.

 

[Sailor.X]

Half of Oklahoma Belongs to Native Tribe, Supreme Court Rules

"If Congress wishes to withdraw its promises, it must say so," Justice Neil Gorsuch wrote in the Supreme Court's opinion for McGirt v. Oklahoma.

www.newsweek.com

So the TL;DR is Congressional laziness and ineptitude means the old reservation was never formally dismantled on the Federal level. Thus most of the state is still a tribal reservation, from a jurisdictional and law enforcement point of view.

Cannot blame SCOTUS for this, this is Congress being dumbasses and forgetting to handle shit.

Indeed. This is why I keep warning people about sending things to the Supreme Court. Because the law can burn both ways. If you don't have all of the I s dotted and all of the T s crossed you can get a nasty legal wake up call.

 

[Flintsteel]

I wonder if a similar situation might be applied to other states with large Native populations, like Alaska or New Mexico. Were other reservations/native land trusts improperly dissolved?

Given this ruling, I'm sure we'll find out in short order everywhere Congress failed to follow their own rules...

 

[Shipmaster Sane]

Yeah if it's handled like they've been handling most cases recently we could see a massive homeless population increase

That maybe the goal, more voters

The vast majority of the chronically homeless are mentally ill.

 

[CarlManvers2019]

The vast majority of the chronically homeless are mentally ill.

Don't forget the middle-to-upper class douchebags with an addiction to "grand causes"

 

[GodIsaSerb]

The vast majority of the chronically homeless are mentally ill.

Yeah and in addition to being mentally ill they are drug addicts to boot. It's almost like the rise in a unstable and dangerous class of homeless directly corresponds to the closure of the asylums at the turn of the 21st century and the sweeping opiate epidemic.

 

[Terthna]

The vast majority of the chronically homeless are mentally ill.

Statistics vary, but the highest percentages of homeless I've seen reported with some form of mental illness is at worst 45%; a significant number, but not a majority.

 

[Shipmaster Sane]

Statistics vary, but the highest percentages of homeless I've seen reported with some form of mental illness is at worst 45%; a significant number, but not a majority.

Chronically. Chronically homeless. The lowest number I've seen is eighty five percent.

 

[GodIsaSerb]

Statistics vary, but the highest percentages of homeless I've seen reported with some form of mental illness is at worst 45%; a significant number, but not a majority.

According the 2015 AHAR report put out by HUD and summarized by mentalillnesspolicy.org:

564,708 people were homeless on a given night in the United States. Depending on the age group in question, and how homelessness is defined, the consensus estimate as of 2014 was that, at minimum, 25 percent of the American homeless—140,000 individuals—were seriously mentally ill at any given point in time. Forty-five percent of the homeless—250,000 individuals—had any mental illness. More would be labeled homeless if these were annual counts rather than point-in-time counts.

Read more at: https://mentalillnesspolicy.org/consequences/homeless-mentally-ill.html

The important phrases here are "on a given night" and "depending on ... how homelessness is defined". That 45% number is not constrained to the chronically homeless that we are talking about. The rates among the chronically homeless are far higher than 45%.

 

[Terthna]

According the 2015 AHAR report put out by HUD and summarized by mentalillnesspolicy.org:

564,708 people were homeless on a given night in the United States. Depending on the age group in question, and how homelessness is defined, the consensus estimate as of 2014 was that, at minimum, 25 percent of the American homeless—140,000 individuals—were seriously mentally ill at any given point in time. Forty-five percent of the homeless—250,000 individuals—had any mental illness. More would be labeled homeless if these were annual counts rather than point-in-time counts.

Read more at: Homeless Mentally Ill Facts and Figures : Mental Illness Policy Org

The important phrases here are "on a given night" and "depending on ... how homelessness is defined". That 45% number is not constrained to the chronically homeless that we are talking about. The rates among the chronically homeless are far higher than 45%.

You also have to take into account how broad "any mental illness" is; as it probably includes depression and, according to the Mayo Clinic, about 1 in 5 adults has a mental illness in any given year.

 

[GodIsaSerb]

You also have to take into account how broad "any mental illness" is; as it probably includes depression and, according to the Mayo Clinic, about 1 in 5 adults has a mental illness in any given year.

I was looking at the 25% number not really the 45% figure for any mental illness. The rate among chronically homeless is much, much higher than 25% for the "generally" homeless. I've worked in the healthcare field specifically dealing with the homeless and at risk and I've seen nurses pick a mountain of maggots from a homeless man's body and the man couldn't understand why it was an issue that he had maggots eating his necrotic flesh. There are very high rates of serious mental health issues in the chronically homeless community. I ended up leaving that field partially because it was too depressing to see every single day.

 

[LordsFire]

I was looking at the 25% number not really the 45% figure for any mental illness. The rate among chronically homeless is much, much higher than 25% for the "generally" homeless. I've worked in the healthcare field specifically dealing with the homeless and at risk and I've seen nurses pick a mountain of maggots from a homeless man's body and the man couldn't understand why it was an issue that he had maggots eating his necrotic flesh. There are very high rates of serious mental health issues in the chronically homeless community. I ended up leaving that field partially because it was too depressing to see every single day.

25% is a huge percent for any one demographic to have.

 

[Bacle]

Can we maybe take this discussion to it's own thread.

It's a subject worthy of discussion, but it's not really on topic here.

 

[Hlaalu Agent]

No, just do what they did with the Natives in Alaska; incorporate the tribes as tribal corporations, instead of as local govs.

Makes the laws governing thier land far harder to abuse, because land then becomes a private corporate property, not a separate jurisdiction.

I believe they did that in Northern Quebec, or something similar,

Makivik Corporation - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Which lends credence to your argument.

 

[Es Arcanum]

Shouldn't have signed treaties with the people you were conquering in undeclared wars let alone given them semi-autonomous status.


I'm sure that any private property held by people will be fine under squatter laws if nothing else. The interesting thing will be what negotiations may take place regarding state owned lands.

 

[Doomsought]

It seems to be restricted to just some high crimes being under federal jurisdiction rather than state or Indian, but the legal system can take some wild interpretations of things.

 

[Floridaman]

It seems to be restricted to just some high crimes being under federal jurisdiction rather than state or Indian, but the legal system can take some wild interpretations of things.

I think they just made that ruling up wholesale to prevent unneeded chaos.