Star Wars Star Wars Discussion Thread - LET THE PAST D-! Oh, wait, nevermind

[Hlaalu Agent]

They definitely made valiant efforts to retcon things into harmony, but. . . "The events of the Jedi Prince books as told in the books were abridged and censored bedtime stories Leia told her kids, but the basic events *did actually happen*." is still deeply bizarre, especially when they then doubled down with the specific detail that Kadann and the Prophets of the Dark Side really exist, it’s just the ones the Rebels met weren’t actually them, but Imperial agents pretending to be them as part of a bizarre long term plot by Palpatine to discredit them.

Well, it does make sense with how much of an actual dick Palpatine was. I am sure he probably would have long running plans designed solely to fuck with someone - solely for his own twisted amusement. So, maybe we can pretend Palpy is doing it for the sheer entertainment value of making a serious Dark Side Cult look like a bunch of larpers.

 

[Bear Ribs]

I genuinely don't understand why people think the whole "Dark Greetings" is so silly in the first place. It doesn't strike me as any odder than the tendency Americans have to immediately pronounce a blessing on anyone who sneezes. Every culture has its different customs.

 

[Hlaalu Agent]

I genuinely don't understand why people think the whole "Dark Greetings" is so silly in the first place. It doesn't strike me as any odder than the tendency Americans have to immediately pronounce a blessing on anyone who sneezes. Every culture has its different customs.

I think I find it funny, because it seems so tryhard and over the top. The utter absurdity of them doing it, and how larpy it is. But I can actually take it seriously for the same reason... so I am probably laughing my ass off while letting it slide, as it doesn't at all violate verisimilitude or break my suspension of disbelief. Of course people trying to avow their loyalty to an ideology are going to go balls deep and probably take it to the silliest extreme. Remember all of the daffy things extremist regimes have done it the past, such as the "rationalistic" everything of Revolutionary France, or over 50% of what the Communists and Fascists did.

Though I am Canadian, so it might not be at all the same thing.

 

[Urabrask Revealed]

If they don't retcon or change her in some way. Shoot who would they get to play Dr. Aphra?

Why should anyone play a disney character? Let that cunt stay in the trash.

 

[Bacle]

Well, Bad Batch just went...stupid.

Spoiler

That is the only way I can describe the actions and plot in the last episode.

Going back to Syd was an idiot ball moment, as was leaving EZ with Syd in the first place; they could have taken Omega to Pabu for treatment.

Tech effectively died for nothing, and not just because Saw Gerrara upset their plan.

Omega damn near handed herself to the Empire, and now we get the 'twist' that the red haired researcher working with Hemlock is Omega's 'sister', so either she's a clone of Omega with rapid aging, or Omega is a clone of her for some reason.

Which means Omega is not just a sex-swapped clone of Jango, as we had thought.

I get this sets of a Season 3 arc of rescuing Omega, had serious loss, and establishes stakes, but there were loads better ways this could have been handled without idiot ball moments.

At least the Mando episode was fun and actually is advancing the plot significantly. Seeing the reclamation of Mandalore and Bo-Katan getting deserved credit as a leader of Mando's, is a good way to go after this...rather lukewarm showing by the Bad Batch this season.

Bad Batch is really only good for the villians, the main cast and Omega are now kinda...too many idiotballs rolled into one for supposedly intelligent commando's to keep serious interest in it.

Bad Batch is falling too far into the hole Rebels did with 'stupid kids moments by protag ruins plans/fucks things, but it's ok' and making the Bad Batch look like buffoons and bumbling big brothers/dads who screwed themselves with multiple poor decisions stacking on top of each other.

 

[ShadowArxxy]

I genuinely don't understand why people think the whole "Dark Greetings" is so silly in the first place. It doesn't strike me as any odder than the tendency Americans have to immediately pronounce a blessing on anyone who sneezes. Every culture has its different customs.

It wouldn't be silly if they said it *once or twice* or in a formal, ritualistic setting. It's silly because they say it ALL THE DAMN TIME, and because it's part of a trend throughout those books where the Prophets constantly say "Dark this, Dark that" to an absurdly gratuitous degree.

And then it's even sillier with the retcon where the Prophets (as encountered by the Rebels) aren't even Force-sensitive, they are literally a bunch of randos that Palpatine taught to Dark Side LARP to the point where they. . . keep doing it after Palpatine dies.

 

[KilroywasNOTHere]

So I'm not sure if this should fall under gaming creative writing or here, I'm just going to put it here for now.

So Character AI has a variety of Chat Bots and one of them is a Star Wars Text adventure game. It's not perfect, but it does provide some cool moments and I'd figure I'd post one

I'll call this Scenario: Rise Of the Hutt It doesn't actually do dates, but I'll place them where I see fit to create a more coherent timeline. Basically, I played Jabba the Hutt at the beginning of the rescue of Han Solo...

Rise Of the Hutt

4: ABY

Luke Skywalker tries to threaten me rather than drop him into the beast bit to fight the Rancor, I go ahead and just have Boba Fett Fight him. The fight is brief but brutal but Boba Fett manages to come out on top, killing Luke. Rather than throw Han and Chewbacca into the Sarlacc Pit I end up selling Han to an Imperial Spice Mine on Kessel
I decided to try and get Chewbacca by my side by offering to help free Kashyyyk from imperial rule. He doesn't trust me at first but does say he will pledge loyalty to me if I keep my word but will gut me if I don't.

In the meantime, I try to seduce Leia to the Hedonistic side by rewarding her with good food and other luxury items. At first she is resistant, but as she realizes she's basically a sitting duck, she agrees to be one of my dancers.

4.2: ABY

I assemble a small crew of Pirates to Take the Kashyyyk shipyards Boba and Chewie will lead these pirates. they capture the imperial Space Station and even a Star Destroyer. They use the newly captured assets to bombard the imperial ground forces wiping them out.

Chewbacca manages to unite the tribes under his banner and becomes the High Chieftan of the Planet. Kashyyyk and the Wookies become loyal to Chewbacca and me, and some of their strongest warriors offer to become mercenaries for me.

4.3: ABY

The Battle Of Endor leads to disaster for the rebellion. With its major heroes out of commission. Vader leads a ground force and crushes the ground force leaving the shield generator intact. All of the remaining Major leaders of the rebellion are killed or captured and executed leaving the survivors to scatter.

4.5 ABY

After a few months, Leia finds herself comfortably in my court and becomes my Spymaster

She tells me that the spies reveal the existence of the second Death Star. meanwhile, after the execution of the rebel leaders, The Empire Throws a grand celebration for the destruction of the alliance. The Emperor gives a grand speech.

"The Rebellion is no more. With its destruction, we shall bring about a new age of peace and expansion. Those Who are not with us will fall, and we shall stand for the next 1000 years."

(Ok at this point I realize the empire is a major threat to me, so I decided to shoot for the moon. I want to take the Death Star II for myself. Leia informed me that while I could take it with my fleet it'd be a huge risk. I decide instead to take a big gambit and try to reprogram IG-88 to be completely loyal to me and bribe someone in the empire to install IG-88s droid brain core as the main computer system for the station essentially giving me full control of the station. Essentially, I attempted to reenact Therefore I Am: The Tale of IG-88 minus the threat of a droid revolution...and it ACTUALLY worked)

After lots of hard work, my tech people manage to reprogram IG-88 to be completely loyal to me. I extract his reprogrammed droid brain and bribe a high-ranking imperial officer to use the droid brain as the base for the Death Star's system. I have the Death Star reprogram the droids and internal defense systems to wipe out the imperial forces. I now have full control of the station.

I hover the death star over Coruscant and use a portion of the Superlasers power to nuke the imperial palace from orbit. The Emperor, Vader, and the lionshare of imperial leadership are wiped out in a single fell swoop. (Along with probably millions of Coruscant natives but eh...)

The Galaxy is left in a state of Anarchy as I have no intention of taking the galaxy for myself (despite the fact that the game is REALLY trying to steer me in that direction)

I turn The Death Star into a Full blown Luxury Haven with all sorts of Casnios restaurants and entertainment venues for all of the galaxy's wretched scum and villainy. I rename it The Sleepless Star Resort and I use it as my new headquarters above Tattooine


Sith Cultist try cloning Vader and The Emperor using a hidden Cloning Facility of Unknown Origin on Geonosis. I have my forces quickly wipe out the cultist and I use the facility to make a clone army for myself and I create a clone army using Boba Fett as the Template

5 ABY:

I discover that Ahsoka Tano is for all intents and purposes the last remaining Jedi. Feeling as though I owe her still for saving Rotta (even though he's dead) I give her My old palace for her to use as a new jedi temple/academy which she accepts.

Han Solo is apparently active again (guessing he escaped Kessel in the initial fall of the empire and offers to work with me again...I politly decline his offer

Leia and I overtime fall and love and get married

That's as far as I've played so far. I have to say I'm pretty interested in these AI chatbots.

 

[Bigking321]

As a fan of the star wars EU I feel a instinctive hatred and revulsion towards the universe you have created.

But, that aside, that's pretty neat.

How does that work? It provides prompts and writes up results based on your choices? Are dice rolls involved?

 

[KilroywasNOTHere]

As a fan of the star wars EU I feel a instinctive hatred and revulsion towards the universe you have created.

But, that aside, that's pretty neat.

How does that work? It provides prompts and writes up results based on your choices? Are dice rolls involved?

Hahaha ok which part do you hate the most and why

It's randomly generated I will admit I had to go through a lot of different responses to avoid repeat and contradictory events. I honestly think I've just about reached the limit as to what this thing can do but it actually generates responses based on what you write and so far. You can reject the responses and have it come up with new ones and I did do that on occasion to avoid repeats or come up with slightly different events.

The issues I'm having the most issues with is that it keeps wanting me to takeover the galaxy as the new emperor and even become a sith lord (Why?) and it has a VERY hard time creating new factions especially from scratch. So far the only faction of Note is The Shadow Order Led by a Dark Jedi named Azoroth Reeg and so far the Shadow Order and Azaroth Reeg control Alderaan (the Graveyard), Endor, Bespin, and the Planet of the Dead. (I'm guessing the Chatbot is thinking of Korriban)
apparently he was able to reunite the shattered remains of the rebel alliance and use them to create The Shadow Order. I guess the heroes like Leia, Luke and Mon Mothma were the only thing keeping the rebels moral compass in tact.

 

[Bigking321]

Hahaha ok which part do you hate the most and why

What it does to the main characters I suppose. I hate the Disney stuff because of the rampant setting and character assassination.

Characters joining up with Jabba after killing Luke and sending Han off to slave in a mine? Nah. No way.

Still cool that it can do this at all though.

 

[Typhonis]

You know they missed a good oprotunity in the Sequal Trilogy. Imagine Rey, Poe and Finn trying to figure out why the First Order is attacking the New Republic, only to discover the Resistance has been raiding FO bases. At one point they arrive on the planet Bling Blinga to discover the arms merchants will sell anyone with enough credits to pay for the weapons and someone had been buying FO and NR starships.
Turns out it is a Hutt trying to ferment war between the two groups so he can make a tidy profit.

 

[Skallagrim]

You know they missed a good oprotunity in the Sequal Trilogy. Imagine Rey, Poe and Finn trying to figure out why the First Order is attacking the New Republic, only to discover the Resistance has been raiding FO bases. At one point they arrive on the planet Bling Blinga to discover the arms merchants will sell anyone with enough credits to pay for the weapons and someone had been buying FO and NR starships.
Turns out it is a Hutt trying to ferment war between the two groups so he can make a tidy profit.

Yet another premise that would have made more sense than what we got. Better yet: cut out the First Order, and have them be a more "regular" Imperial Remnant that signed a peace treaty not too long after Endor. They're not insane fanatics, and there's been peace ever since. Then both sides start accusing the other of attacking then without provocation, and it looks like there'll be another war...

Some shady crime cartel -- which wouldn't have to (limited to) the Hutts -- being behind it since they control the arms industry and are seeking to exploit such a conflict (both via profit, and due to organised crime getting easier in a chaotic situation) is an idea that fits perfectly with some of George Lucas's sequel ideas. The idea of large corporations (in this case the arms industry) being villains also calls back to the prequels, so it fits into the larger theme.


This plot can easily be combined with ideas we've discussed on this site before:

Another option, that I've thought about before, was to present a Ben Solo-analogue (a son of Han and Leia, doesn't have to be the same guy) as an anti-Imperial fanatic, instead of a neo-Imperial. In such a scenario, a peace has been signed and an Imperial Remnant still exists... and he wants to destroy it. Make him the ultimate Cold Warrior expy, the kind of guy who advocated all-out first nuclear strike against the USSR, but set in the SW galaxy. Then the story becomes about choosing moderation, reason and forgiveness (even for those who may not deserve it) instead of persecuting vengeance to the bitter end, no matter how many innocents die in the cross-fire.

honestly when it got leaked that one of the main charecters was going to be a good stormtrooper I kinda hoped we'd see a good imperial remenent (Like maybe a 501st that does hummanitairn efforts for the planets still recovering from the war (kinda like what the 501st do IRL) and maybe a more nuanced star wars, but no we got the same ol story.

A bunch of good stormtroopers, trying to just make a good life for the people in their neck of the woods, and then being hunted by this radical faction of "it aint't over 'till every Imp is dead!" aligned with a failed or failing New Republic -- that would be a pretty cool set-up.

You could even balance it out by still having a fanatical First Order (or expy thereof), with most of their propaganda being fed by the atrocities committed by the radical "New Republic" faction. On the other side, we'd have our OT heroes (and new faces, like Poe) being opposed to the fanatics on "their" side. So they'd end up working together with the "chill" stormtroopers, and the fanatics on both sides would acually turn out to be very much alike!

(It would also make more sense for Han and Leia's son to be on the radical fringe of their side, rather than becoming a Neo-Imperial.)

The New Republic and the Imperial Remnant both have trigger happy "radical" factions, and the crime syndicate is exploiting those sentiments to push the galaxy towards another war. The son of Han and Leia isn't a traitor who joined the Imperials, but a member of the fanatical anti-Imperial group in the New Republic. Finn is a moderate, "normal guy" stormtrooper in the Imperial Remnant.

In the end, the conspiracy is uncovered, the crme syndicate is defeated, the radical Neo-Imperials are brought down, and the radicals in the New Republic are either improsoned or they repent and change their views. The New Republic and the Imperial Remnant sign a more durable treaty, and their trade relations (et cetera) are normalised.


...Of course, Tim Zahn already wrote something very much lik this story back in 1999, for the original EU. It's a duology called The Hand of Thrawn.

 

[ShadowArxxy]

Yet another premise that would have made more sense than what we got. Better yet: cut out the First Order, and have them be a more "regular" Imperial Remnant that signed a peace treaty not too long after Endor. They're not insane fanatics, and there's been peace ever since. Then both sides start accusing the other of attacking then without provocation, and it looks like there'll be another war...

Some shady crime cartel -- which wouldn't have to (limited to) the Hutts -- being behind it since they control the arms industry and are seeking to exploit such a conflict (both via profit, and due to organised crime getting easier in a chaotic situation) is an idea that fits perfectly with some of George Lucas's sequel ideas. The idea of large corporations (in this case the arms industry) being villains also calls back to the prequels, so it fits into the larger theme.


This plot can easily be combined with ideas we've discussed on this site before:







The New Republic and the Imperial Remnant both have trigger happy "radical" factions, and the crime syndicate is exploiting those sentiments to push the galaxy towards another war. The son of Han and Leia isn't a traitor who joined the Imperials, but a member of the fanatical anti-Imperial group in the New Republic. Finn is a moderate, "normal guy" stormtrooper in the Imperial Remnant.

In the end, the conspiracy is uncovered, the crme syndicate is defeated, the radical Neo-Imperials are brought down, and the radicals in the New Republic are either improsoned or they repent and change their views. The New Republic and the Imperial Remnant sign a more durable treaty, and their trade relations (et cetera) are normalised.


...Of course, Tim Zahn already wrote something very much lik this story back in 1999, for the original EU. It's a duology called The Hand of Thrawn.

My headcanon for Phasma’s actions in Force Awakens fell along these lines. Because even with Rey and Finn holding her at gunpoint, they had no way of actually making her shut down the shield as opposed to triggering a fail safe, and First Order are supposed to be fanatics who wouldn’t hesitate to die for their cause . . . so I came up with my own rationalization that she wasn’t truly a First Order loyalist, but an undercover Imperial Remnant intelligence operative. So she wasn’t exactly on the same side as the Resistance, but she did want them to succeed.

 

[Typhonis]

So, how do they find out? Good old detective work and a bit of a lesson Rey learned from Luke.

"Follow the money. " Figure out who is paying for this. Where are they getting the supplies from? Where are the fighters being stationed? Comes up they have a Venator classStar Destroyer, but it has seen better days. The fighters launch and dock from it. They easily see both Imperial and Republic attack craft docked in it. The fight at the end of the movie is the heroes taking it down.

 

[Jaenera Targaryen]

It wouldn't work, because it wouldn't be woke enough for the left-wing mob. It'd send the wrong message, that you can somehow compromise with the right-wing, and that any part of the left-wing could in any way be wrong.

 

[DarthOne]

It wouldn't work, because it wouldn't be woke enough for the left-wing mob. It'd send the wrong message, that you can somehow compromise with the right-wing, and that any part of the left-wing could in any way be wrong.

Well the first mistake in that assumption is that we give a damn about what they think. We’re here to make money and create a good storyline, not appeal to a comparatively small subset of the population.

If they complain we just tell them condescendingly that they weren’t the ‘target audience’. Which is what they like to say when people complain about their propaganda. As the Brits would say ‘turn about is fair play luv.’

 

[Typhonis]

It wouldn't work, because it wouldn't be woke enough for the left-wing mob. It'd send the wrong message, that you can somehow compromise with the right-wing, and that any part of the left-wing could in any way be wrong.

The idea here is to make money off of Star Wars, not spew propaganda. Because at the end of the day, will the Left crowd spend money to see the movie?

 

[Jaenera Targaryen]

Wait, we're roleplaying?

Sorry, sorry, really sorry, I didn't notice that

 

[AspblastUSA]

I didn’t pick up on the RP aspect either. I’d thought the idea was just to pitch sequel trilogies from a more perfect world, where ideologues weren’t sticking their slimy fingers into everything.

 

[Skallagrim]

Wait, we're roleplaying?

Sorry, sorry, really sorry, I didn't notice that

I didn’t pick up on the RP aspect either. I’d thought the idea was just to pitch sequel trilogies from a more perfect world, where ideologues weren’t sticking their slimy fingers into everything.

Yeah, I think "this would never fly, sadly, because Disney cares more about bullshit messaging than about telling a good story" is a completely sensible comment. It's just the unfortunate reality.

On the other hand "if I were making this, I'd give zero fucks about what the likes of Disney wants" is also a perfectly legitimate view. I assume @DarthOne and @Typhonis are viewing this whole matter as a hypothetical this-is-how-I'd-do-it scenario, whereas @Jaenera Targaryen was looking at it more from a real-world perspective (i.e. considering the underlying reason why something like this wasn't done).

In conclusion: Disney sucks, and old man Walt is turning over in his grave.