Starship Troopers general thread

ThatZenoGuy

Zealous Evolutionary Nano Organism
Uh, those don't look that dissimilar to each other. They appear far closer than the Chariot bugs look to any of the other Arachnid castes. The fact that few, if any, Arachnid casts actually look like they belong to the same species or even related species but instead seem to be random anthropoids slotted into a given role further lends credence to the idea rather than distracts from it. Why do they all look so different? Because they all were different species from different worlds until the Arachnids assimilated them.

And I will note you yourself commented on how it was a "common misconception" to assume both bugs were one and the same so the differences can't be that massive.
Oh I agree it is a very very common misconception even I only realized after watching the film half a hundred times.
But they do have distinct shapes, angles, and colors. Brown vs Red, flat top vs curved top, etc.
If we ignore Buenos Aires and the destruction of zegema beach in Starship troopers, Behemecoatyl desire to destroy humanity in Starship Trooper 3, Trig's destroyed home town in Starship Troopers invasion, the apparently common occurrence of Arachnid spores seeding Federation worlds in Starship Troopers Traitors of Mars. The Bugs have always been portrayed as hyperaggressive monsters obsessed with wiping out humanity.
The bugs, a race which has no technology of any kind can pinpoint snipe a city from across the galaxy WITH A ROCK, despite countless defences and early warning systems in between the two empires?...Unlikely.
Also ST2 and ST3 are the results of writers/producers not understanding the first film, predictably they go with the very literal interpretation of a propaganda film.
In contrast we see the Federation actively tries to avoid war with the Arachnids establishing a quarantine zone for the Arachnid empire to inhabit and colonize and even the state approved media openly questioning on the eve of war if a "Live and let live" approach was better than invading Klendathu.
Everything you see the Federation do is from a slanted angle, Arachnids have been known for quite sometime (maybe even tens of years) and judging from all the maimed adults/old people they've fought them before. The Federation need somebody to punch to keep their act together, bugs are just a great way to have a war.

Eh chalk it up to scifi writers have no sense of scale or the Bugs are more capable than the Federation at the time suspected. Which makes sense since they didn't even seem to believe the Arachnids were intelligent before the Bug War.
They are aware the bugs can colonize other planets, but judging from how effective their anti-space weapons are (blindly launching crap into space and praying the federation are stupid enough to ram into it), I doubt their colonizing abilities are especially fast or efficient.
 

ATP

Well-known member
Here is a question. Where are the worker bugs? Someone had to dig out the tunnels and the warrior bugs don't have the mandibles to do that.
In books they existed - and never fight.That is why Rico knew that their attack was distraction,becouse they do not schoot at him.
Yep,book bugs have laser rifles,and they have mechanical cyvilization - not bioweapons from movie.
 

ThatZenoGuy

Zealous Evolutionary Nano Organism
In books they existed - and never fight.That is why Rico knew that their attack was distraction,becouse they do not schoot at him.
Yep,book bugs have laser rifles,and they have mechanical cyvilization - not bioweapons from movie.
Yep, the bugs are more like techno-zerg in the books.
 
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ATP

Well-known member
Yep, the bugs are more like techno-zerg in the books.
I read some fanfictions,and apparently there existed also so called Coven/alien womans who cbrainwash people - stronger Asari basically/ and Fourth - aliens with lot of Mechs.
 

ThatZenoGuy

Zealous Evolutionary Nano Organism
I read some fanfictions,and apparently there existed also so called Coven/alien womans who cbrainwash people - stronger Asari basically/ and Fourth - aliens with lot of Mechs.
I know that the books had 'skinnies', who were allied/dominated by the bugs and were pretty awesome in the animated TV series.
 

Bear Ribs

Well-known member
Yeah, I rather liked that T'Phai also had a well-developed character and personality quirk* besides being just "the alien."

*Specifically T'Phai was built up as having superhuman levels of patience and self-control.
 

ThatZenoGuy

Zealous Evolutionary Nano Organism
Yep,i remember one of them joining squad and showing picture of his children.
Yeah, I rather liked that T'Phai also had a well-developed character and personality quirk* besides being just "the alien."

*Specifically T'Phai was built up as having superhuman levels of patience and self-control.
You guys have no idea how much of a relief it is to know there are others who know an obscure alien dude from an equally obscure kinda-the-film-but-also-kinda-the-book TV show.

T'Phai was fucking awesome.
 

ATP

Well-known member
Yeah, I rather liked that T'Phai also had a well-developed character and personality quirk* besides being just "the alien."

*Specifically T'Phai was built up as having superhuman levels of patience and self-control.
Sometimes he looked like only adult in his squad.Well,one of few adults there.

You guys have no idea how much of a relief it is to know there are others who know an obscure alien dude from an equally obscure kinda-the-film-but-also-kinda-the-book TV show.

T'Phai was fucking awesome.
He still is awesome !
 

Crom's Black Blade

Well-known member
Oh I agree it is a very very common misconception even I only realized after watching the film half a hundred times.
But they do have distinct shapes, angles, and colors. Brown vs Red, flat top vs curved top, etc.
It's just that these don't seem like very major differences. If anything these seem like the differences you might find between subspecies of the same thing rather than two unrelated animals. Again highlighting how similar they are and how unsimilar Arachnids are too each other.

It would be one thing if the two beetles just happened to resemble each other due to convergent evolution, similar environments producing similar bodytypes, but if I understand you correctly you are suggesting the Arachnids bioengineer their different castes. And it boggles my mind that an intelligent design, rather than impersonal forces, could so closely mirror another lifeform so closely that they've never encountered.

The bugs, a race which has no technology of any kind can pinpoint snipe a city from across the galaxy WITH A ROCK, despite countless defences and early warning systems in between the two empires?...Unlikely.
well if we're talking out of universe, yeah it is a little far-fetched which is why I lean towards the Arachnids being more capable than just STL asteroid slinging. Possibility manipulating gravity to form wormholes to leapfrog asteroids and spores across interstellar distances. Which would neatly explain the rather overly strong gravimetric force the rock the Roger Young encountered.

The Doylist explanation is likely Paul Verhoeven was either unaware or didn't care about the actual distances involved and just thought plasma directed asteroids worked well with his version of the Arachnids.

In-universe however the plausibility of the Bugs being capable of "pinpoint {sniping} a city" is set in stone. Even if the Federation framed them they have to have the capability to do so in order for it to be believable.

Also ST2 and ST3 are the results of writers/producers not understanding the first film, predictably they go with the very literal interpretation of a propaganda film.
Actually I would say ST2 and especially ST3 double-downed on the "Humans are the real bastards" hinted at in ST1 and if anything I think their weakness/failure to actually make the Terran Federation the true villains in this regard are because they agreed too much with Paul Verhoeven's vision/world view rather than misunderstanding it. Namely, in my opinion, the reason why the Bugs are presented as one-dimensional, omnicide maniacs against humanity is because the Terrans are "Fascists", which in this case should be translated as a straw effigy of everyone Verhoeven doesn't like politically, and thus deserve to be exterminated by the Arachnids. Because that's how leftists think. Not in good actions/bad actions but "good people"/"bad people" where anything a "good person" does is morally justified because they did it.


Everything you see the Federation do is from a slanted angle
Even if I were to grant you the idea that it's "slanted", which I've seen no evidence to suggest that, it would be the only frame of reference we have. Your basically arguing we should disregard the actual canon of the movie in favor of your preference of what the universe should be.

Arachnids have been known for quite sometime (maybe even tens of years) and judging from all the maimed adults/old people they've fought them before.
The Arachnids certainly were known about before the events of the movie. The Quarantine zone was established, Rico's teacher had a hologram and at least basic knowledge of their race ect. Through it's unclear if humanity ever fought with them and it's certainly doesn't show the humans were the aggressor.


The Federation need somebody to punch to keep their act together, bugs are just a great way to have a war.
Except we see no evidence of that. Ironically ST: 3 does show civil protest and unrest by a persecuted minority but not the 1997 film which depicts the Federation as pretty idyllic, stable and, if lt. Rasczak is anything to go by, focused on encouraging both independent thought and civic virtue in their young. Between them and our timeline I know which one I'd rather live in.

They are aware the bugs can colonize other planets, but judging from how effective their anti-space weapons are (blindly launching crap into space and praying the federation are stupid enough to ram into it), I doubt their colonizing abilities are especially fast or efficient.
When using unguided "dumb" munitions, relying on volume of fire to saturate the target is certainly not the worst tactic ever. Either the Federation is forced to release their dropships further out, creating a further buffer for the fragile dropships to be picked off, or the Federation has to take it on the chin and fly into your defensive screen.

Further it's implied the Bugs deliberately baited the Federation misleading them into thinking the plasma would be light and sporadic when it would be anything but. So the Bugs almost certainly are aware of and thus have some means to detect/observe their spaceborn adversaries. In comparison detecting planets is likely child's play.
 

Typhonis

Well-known member
I think it is called Starship Troopers Insect Touch, a prequel comic where the bugs nearly colonized Earth but landed on an unterraformed Mars and the lack of O2 killed them.

It has a young Razchek in it and shows how he lost his arm in the first conflict with the bugs. A conflict which alerted them to the fact we existed.
 

Husky_Khan

The Dog Whistler... I mean Whisperer.
Founder
Actually I would say ST2 and especially ST3 double-downed on the "Humans are the real bastards" hinted at in ST1 and if anything I think their weakness/failure to actually make the Terran Federation the true villains in this regard are because they agreed too much with Paul Verhoeven's vision/world view rather than misunderstanding it. Namely, in my opinion, the reason why the Bugs are presented as one-dimensional, omnicide maniacs against humanity is because the Terrans are "Fascists", which in this case should be translated as a straw effigy of everyone Verhoeven doesn't like politically, and thus deserve to be exterminated by the Arachnids. Because that's how leftists think. Not in good actions/bad actions but "good people"/"bad people" where anything a "good person" does is morally justified because they did it.

Except we see no evidence of that. Ironically ST: 3 does show civil protest and unrest by a persecuted minority but not the 1997 film which depicts the Federation as pretty idyllic, stable and, if lt. Rasczak is anything to go by, focused on encouraging both independent thought and civic virtue in their young. Between them and our timeline I know which one I'd rather live in.

Yeah the original film was meant to display the Terran Federation as a Fascist Utopia or as others (and meeee) have stated, an anti-Star Trek style Utopia. But a lot of the fascist overtones are stylish due to it being satire and not of substance. There are scenes which remind a viewer of "fascism" in a general sense from scenes like kids stomping cockroaches to the glee of their teacher, a murderer being sentenced and then executed on public television later in the day, and all of the militarism stuff sprinkled throughout it all.

But there's also a scene that was likely overlooked for its "fascist" overtones because it was the defiant last words of the rival Fleet love interest who said "Some day someone that looks like me is going to kill you and your entire fucking race," which as I noted on the first page already, would be a pretty shocking thing to say to another ethnic group for example, but also a Klingon or Romulan or Asari or what have you as opposed to omnicidal bugs.

It might be fascist, but we haven't seen much substantial evils as one would associate with fascist empires that we know of in fiction and nonfiction. So the Verhoeven satire made it a pretty appealing fascist utopia.

Gene Roddenberry would be proud. :sneaky:

And it makes sense. Robocop and Total Recall also satirized ideology and politics but it was all about style over substance as well and it still made for excellent films which do give you just enough to think about beyond the action.

I think it is called Starship Troopers Insect Touch, a prequel comic where the bugs nearly colonized Earth but landed on an unterraformed Mars and the lack of O2 killed them.

It has a young Razchek in it and shows how he lost his arm in the first conflict with the bugs. A conflict which alerted them to the fact we existed.

Oh that's interesting. If anything it shows the Terran Federation was willing to live and let live to some degree (depending on the nature and strictness of the Quarantine Zone).
 

ThatZenoGuy

Zealous Evolutionary Nano Organism
Another way to look at Starship troopers...Fascists vs Communists. The Bugs are definitely commies. :)
Are they though? The bugs just lounge around bug-planets and munch on people landing on said planets.
It's only in ST2 and ST3 where they actually start messing with human planets officially.
 

Crom's Black Blade

Well-known member
Starship Troopers: Invasion.



Back in 2012 when a Japanese Studio did a CGI take on the film franchise.

First of two films animated in Japan, with the second being Traitor of Mars.

Starship Troopers: Invasion is an awesome movie. I easily hold it up alongside the 1997 film and a huge step up from the mediocre sequels.

I won't pretend the movie is super complex or has some original plot but seeing the franchise go full ALIENS with Colonial marines er, I mean Mobile Infantry fighting through a bug infested starship was everything I wanted out a Starship Trooper movie.
 

ShadowArxxy

Well-known member
Comrade
Starship Troopers: Invasion is an awesome movie. I easily hold it up alongside the 1997 film and a huge step up from the mediocre sequels.

I won't pretend the movie is super complex or has some original plot but seeing the franchise go full ALIENS with Colonial marines er, I mean Mobile Infantry fighting through a bug infested starship was everything I wanted out a Starship Trooper movie.
They're still not proper Cap Troopers, but a lot closer to it than previously seen on the SST movie franchise, with what appears to be powered half-armor inspired by those DARPA leg assist concept designs.
 

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