TheRejectionist
TheRejectionist
TLDR. Morrowind feels small because it's almost a vintage game so technical limitations are the limit. Bethesda also wasn't that big as today post-FO3 and New Vegas and Skyrim.
The Elder Scrolls - thread: No lollygaggin' here!
- Thread starter Tyzuris
- Start date
TheRejectionist
TheRejectionist
Bethesda likely would screw it up.
ParadiseLost
Well-known member
I wish we had a dislike button right now.
Skyrim would never have had it's longevity or quality if it had been a generic UE game.
Given that Skyrim has had another edition, I guess I should give it another go. Does anyone have to- I mean mod suggestions or modlist suggestions?
Val the Moofia Boss
Well-known member
Too many great mods to succinctly name. That's the problem with Skyrim. You have to spend dozens of hours researching mod compatibility, installing them, trying to juggle your load order, and then it all breaks.
From what I've heard, Ultimate Skyrim is a stable load order that has pretty much most of the great mods and makes the game look good, so you just install Ultimate Skyrim and that saves you the headache.
Which is why I am probably wanting something light so I can staple on the few mods that I feel are must-haves. And checked it out, looks promising, but I am not using LE.
Morphic Tide
Well-known member
So, one thought that's come back to me with the recent Anniversary Edition compatibility fiasco (interestingly, a lot of it is script timing being screwed up because of optimization) is getting generated loot to meaningfully compete with player craftable items.
For the sake of my sanity, I'll start with the "brackets" set by the generic magic apparel for bonuses for the general "scaling", entirely ignoring the nightmares induced by the loot tables and player specialization:
Enchants for Smithing and Alchemy:
1st Minor: +12% each for +48% at 4 pieces (Alchemy ring doesn't exit in loot, Smithing has chest instead of head)
8th (by jewelry) "Standard": +15% each for +60% at 4 pieces
16th Major: +17% each for +68% at 4 pieces
24th Eminent: +20% each for +80% at 4 pieces
32nd Extreme: +22% each for +88% at 4 pieces
40th Peerless: +25% each for +100% at 4 pieces
Potions for Smithing and Enchantments:
1st Potion: 20% smithing, 10% Enchanting
10th Draught: 30% Smithing, 15% Enchanting
20th Philter: 40% Smithing, 20% Enchanting
30th Elixir: 50% Smithing, 25% Enchanting
So, to start the comparison, let's compare the boosting potions to the player-made: With just full perks, a Fortify Smithing potion comes out at 60%, which then doubles to 120% with the Peerless Alchemy generic magic items. Fortify Enchanting potions have 1/4th the base magnitude, giving 15% and 30% respectively.
Due to the way the smithing formula works, going by UESP, this is actually 4.4x over "naked" results due to alchemy and enchanting stacking multiplicatively. As a consequence, the effective smithing skill is 763, giving 23 quality levels for +41 to armor or weapon damage, +82 for chest armor. Rather overwhelming results.
Cut the potion in half, neatly aligns it with simply double the Enchanting potion and takes it down to ~12 quality levels for +21/+42, much more in line with other bonuses. Stack looted "merely" Legendary (+10/+20) with existing Enchantment brackets and you cover enough of the distance for crafting to not be a necessity.
Then we start on Enchanting. Which doesn't have the formula for effect strength listed in UESP. But Enchanting 100 with no other bonuses takes Disease Resistance (the highest base magnitude enchantment in the game) from 25% to 31%, and Fortify Alchemy increases from 8% to 10%, so I find a 25% increase a safe assumption.
Further testing shows straightforward multiplicative growth, with Fire damage having a base magnitude of 10, increased to 12 with Enchanting 100, then increased to 25 with all five ranks of Enchanter, then 31 with Fire Enchanter. If it holds, then the potion would raise to 40 damage. Absorb, lacking a specialized perk, instead tops off at 20, and the potion would make it 26.
In comparison, the top lootable Absorbtion is 25 points, and Fire Damage is 30 points. The issue here is Extra Effect giving a second slot and items not dropping reinforced. However, Extra Effect is the capstone perk, so its comparison point is the likes of Daedric Artifacts and the randomly-dropped Ebony and up items, meaning the more important thing is the smithing side.
Finally, Alchemy... Will not be tackled in detail because it's utterly mad. Even setting aside overuse of categorization leading to unfortunate feedback loops, the magnitudes are borked all over the place (see Smithing), there are few ingredients straying from base magnitude and duration, and the combination process makes it a tedious memory game more than anything else.
Edit: Overall, it looks like Alchemy, Extra Effect, and the total absence of Smithing outside the player are the main culprits for Skyrim's gearing being so skewed towards player crafting, with Enchanting being so centralizing for reliable access to all your proper bonuses rather than because player-enchanted stuff is ordinarily so much better.
Once the first three are tackled, one way or another, the last is a matter of either massively increasing the drop rates or personalizing what drops beyond raw level brackets. The former dramatically breaks the game design in a number of new ways, so the latter it is, and is a quite simple matter of drawing build-specific things by skill levels.
For the sake of my sanity, I'll start with the "brackets" set by the generic magic apparel for bonuses for the general "scaling", entirely ignoring the nightmares induced by the loot tables and player specialization:
Enchants for Smithing and Alchemy:
1st Minor: +12% each for +48% at 4 pieces (Alchemy ring doesn't exit in loot, Smithing has chest instead of head)
8th (by jewelry) "Standard": +15% each for +60% at 4 pieces
16th Major: +17% each for +68% at 4 pieces
24th Eminent: +20% each for +80% at 4 pieces
32nd Extreme: +22% each for +88% at 4 pieces
40th Peerless: +25% each for +100% at 4 pieces
Potions for Smithing and Enchantments:
1st Potion: 20% smithing, 10% Enchanting
10th Draught: 30% Smithing, 15% Enchanting
20th Philter: 40% Smithing, 20% Enchanting
30th Elixir: 50% Smithing, 25% Enchanting
So, to start the comparison, let's compare the boosting potions to the player-made: With just full perks, a Fortify Smithing potion comes out at 60%, which then doubles to 120% with the Peerless Alchemy generic magic items. Fortify Enchanting potions have 1/4th the base magnitude, giving 15% and 30% respectively.
Due to the way the smithing formula works, going by UESP, this is actually 4.4x over "naked" results due to alchemy and enchanting stacking multiplicatively. As a consequence, the effective smithing skill is 763, giving 23 quality levels for +41 to armor or weapon damage, +82 for chest armor. Rather overwhelming results.
Cut the potion in half, neatly aligns it with simply double the Enchanting potion and takes it down to ~12 quality levels for +21/+42, much more in line with other bonuses. Stack looted "merely" Legendary (+10/+20) with existing Enchantment brackets and you cover enough of the distance for crafting to not be a necessity.
Then we start on Enchanting. Which doesn't have the formula for effect strength listed in UESP. But Enchanting 100 with no other bonuses takes Disease Resistance (the highest base magnitude enchantment in the game) from 25% to 31%, and Fortify Alchemy increases from 8% to 10%, so I find a 25% increase a safe assumption.
Further testing shows straightforward multiplicative growth, with Fire damage having a base magnitude of 10, increased to 12 with Enchanting 100, then increased to 25 with all five ranks of Enchanter, then 31 with Fire Enchanter. If it holds, then the potion would raise to 40 damage. Absorb, lacking a specialized perk, instead tops off at 20, and the potion would make it 26.
In comparison, the top lootable Absorbtion is 25 points, and Fire Damage is 30 points. The issue here is Extra Effect giving a second slot and items not dropping reinforced. However, Extra Effect is the capstone perk, so its comparison point is the likes of Daedric Artifacts and the randomly-dropped Ebony and up items, meaning the more important thing is the smithing side.
Finally, Alchemy... Will not be tackled in detail because it's utterly mad. Even setting aside overuse of categorization leading to unfortunate feedback loops, the magnitudes are borked all over the place (see Smithing), there are few ingredients straying from base magnitude and duration, and the combination process makes it a tedious memory game more than anything else.
Edit: Overall, it looks like Alchemy, Extra Effect, and the total absence of Smithing outside the player are the main culprits for Skyrim's gearing being so skewed towards player crafting, with Enchanting being so centralizing for reliable access to all your proper bonuses rather than because player-enchanted stuff is ordinarily so much better.
Once the first three are tackled, one way or another, the last is a matter of either massively increasing the drop rates or personalizing what drops beyond raw level brackets. The former dramatically breaks the game design in a number of new ways, so the latter it is, and is a quite simple matter of drawing build-specific things by skill levels.
Last edited:
Val the Moofia Boss
Well-known member
At this point I don't really care where the next TES game is set. It's just going to be a boring, mundane real life place, rather than an interesting fantasy land like Morrowind or what Cryodill was supposed to look like before Todd Howard decided to make it into a generic looking place.
Tyzuris
Primarch to your glory& the glory of him on Earth!
The teaser dropped some time (well a longish time ago by now) ago, and it does mention Hammerfell being the place for next TES. I just hope that we'd get the release date (at least to a precision of which year and which quarter) already. And more trailers.
I never played much Skyrim but I did find this greatly amusing.
Over 1800 dead in the genocide!
Apparently he just released a video a few days ago pursuing a similar achievement in Fallout 4.
Over 1800 dead in the genocide!
Apparently he just released a video a few days ago pursuing a similar achievement in Fallout 4.
There's a Morrowind mod that has added two new regions after twenty years.
The Gamer said:
I really need to dust of my Morrowind Install and get a good load order.
TheRejectionist
TheRejectionist
Carrot of Truth
War is Peace
Saw this the other day and it makes me wish there was a story set during thess events, The first era was a really weird 80's style dark fantasy time.
The video answer to the question you never realized you needed answered.
How many Ash Spawns to destroy every City in Skyrim?
How many Ash Spawns to destroy every City in Skyrim?
Tamriel finally progresses in technology... must be the Fifth Era if we keep consistent with the sequels.
Carrot of Truth
War is Peace
ThatZenoGuy
Zealous Evolutionary Nano Organism
Anyone a little bit annoyed by how mages are either instagibbers or completely impotent in Skyrim?
Without magic resist, the fact enemy mages have absurdly buffed magicka means they can burst-fire you faster than even dragons.
But it's also so easy to stack magic resist, and magic absorb that all mages become less dangerous than wildlife.
Which is weird because it's also laughably easy to stack to the armor-cap, so you can gain both nigh invulnerability to magic AND physical attacks within a very reasonable level limit.
Its rather converse to Oblivion where you might go through the entire game with middling armor/magic resist, without mages feeling like headshotting snipers.
Without magic resist, the fact enemy mages have absurdly buffed magicka means they can burst-fire you faster than even dragons.
But it's also so easy to stack magic resist, and magic absorb that all mages become less dangerous than wildlife.
Which is weird because it's also laughably easy to stack to the armor-cap, so you can gain both nigh invulnerability to magic AND physical attacks within a very reasonable level limit.
Its rather converse to Oblivion where you might go through the entire game with middling armor/magic resist, without mages feeling like headshotting snipers.