History What are some of your most contraversial takes on history?

[Zachowon]

James Longstreet (1821–1904) - Encyclopedia Virginia

Longstreet the Soldier Longstreet, who had no middle name, was born on January 8, 1821, near Edgefield, South Carolina, but was raised in Georgia and Alabama. He was graduated from the United States Military Academy at West Point in 1842 and won repeated brevet promotions for conspicuous bravery...

encyclopediavirginia.org

Still looking for the Sherman quote if that's what you want evidence for. It's buried in a book somewhere. I just need to find it.

I was meaning Sherman yes

 

[bintananth]

I was meaning Sherman yes

It might take a while to find because it's not one of his more famous quotes and I don't have a library of "everything Sherman said".

 

[Floridaman]

Even the worst groups have some good people who just got stuck there.

Lt. Gen. James Longstreet, fr'ex, was pretty much the only Confederate General to join the Republican Party and did lead black troops after the Civil War.

EDIT: While he wasn't a shining example of "I'm not a racist" he was certainly less racist than William T. Sherman. Sherman thought that sandbags were more useful than blacks on a battlefield.

I don't really consider joining a political party, a good mark for him... since we'll both parties were looting, and after the fortified 1876 election the GOP spent the next 30 years looting the system. Is him not being the racist characeture interesting, sure but to be honest you could find views all over the spectrum on both sides.

 

[bintananth]

I don't really consider joining a political party, a good mark for him... since we'll both parties were looting, and after the fortified 1876 election the GOP spent the next 30 years looting the system. Is him not being the racist characeture interesting, sure but to be honest you could find views all over the spectrum on both sides.

A former Confederate willing to lead black soldiers after the Civil War was pretty rare. That he happened to be one of the best Generals the Confederates had says something.

 

[Floridaman]

A former Confederate willing to lead black soldiers after the Civil War was pretty rare. That he happened to be one of the best Generals the Confederates had says something.

That part yea, the political party part was what I was referring to. And to be fair it was also rare because ex confederate officers weren’t really allowed back into the military so even if others would have, it is a moot point.

 

[bintananth]

That part yea, the political party part was what I was referring to. And to be fair it was also rare because ex confederate officers weren’t really allowed back into the military so even if others would have, it is a moot point.

If you were to ask my wife to list the 10 best Civil War Generals Robert E. Lee would not be on her list. She thinks he was a wasteful idiot with more aggression than sense. James Longstreet would be on her list right next to Winfield Scott Hancock.

 

[TheRomanSlayer]

Speaking of the "red-headed stepchild of Europe", I was watching a video on YouTube called "Serbia's Secret War". From that video, I could list controversies that may or may not be known:

1) Despite suffering a lot from atrocities committed against its people during WWII, Serbia was actually more efficient in taking part in the Holocaust (under the Nedic government, that is) than Croatia, to the point where the Nazis declared Serbia to be the first nation in Nazi Occupied Europe to be Judenfrei.

2) The Serbs had their own controversial religious figure that acted as a de facto mirror to Cardinal Aloysius Stepinac in Nikolaj Velimirovic. Velimirovic had also expressed his own brand of anti-Semitism, while being locked up under house arrest in Dachau, and he's also canonized as a saint in 2003.

3) The Chetniks pretty much collaborated with any faction, as long as they can come out on top. Whether it was the Germans, or even the Partisans, they wanted to benefit from any kind of collaboration as long as they can benefit from it.

 

[WolfBear]

Speaking of the "red-headed stepchild of Europe", I was watching a video on YouTube called "Serbia's Secret War". From that video, I could list controversies that may or may not be known:

1) Despite suffering a lot from atrocities committed against its people during WWII, Serbia was actually more efficient in taking part in the Holocaust (under the Nedic government, that is) than Croatia, to the point where the Nazis declared Serbia to be the first nation in Nazi Occupied Europe to be Judenfrei.

2) The Serbs had their own controversial religious figure that acted as a de facto mirror to Cardinal Aloysius Stepinac in Nikolaj Velimirovic. Velimirovic had also expressed his own brand of anti-Semitism, while being locked up under house arrest in Dachau, and he's also canonized as a saint in 2003.

3) The Chetniks pretty much collaborated with any faction, as long as they can come out on top. Whether it was the Germans, or even the Partisans, they wanted to benefit from any kind of collaboration as long as they can benefit from it.

So, the Partisans were more honorable than the Chetniks were? And Serbia was a Nazi protectorate rather than an actual independent state like, say, Slovakia or Hungary or even Croatia, right?

 

[TheRomanSlayer]

So, the Partisans were more honorable than the Chetniks were? And Serbia was a Nazi protectorate rather than an actual independent state like, say, Slovakia or Hungary or even Croatia, right?

They were occupied, but had a functioning collaborationist government. Two groups, the Serbian State Guard, and the Serbian Volunteer Corps, also acted as the puppet army serving Milan Nedic, but they were also the military branch of the ZBOR party (yes, Serbia even had a pro-fascist movement, despite claiming that they were anti-fascist).

And no, the Partisans were not honorable, or Bleiburg wouldn't have happened.

The movie in question is here.

 

[WolfBear]

And no, the Partisans were not honorable, or Bleiburg wouldn't have happened.

I said "more honorable"; I did not mean honorable in an absolute sense here. I can likewise say that the Soviet Union was more honorable than the Nazis even though both of them were extremely shitty and murderous totalitarian monster regimes.