I have no problem with that, if you don't mind me making a bit of restructuring of my own, so as to make this more productive? Let us first agree on at least a select understanding. My point about the angels being a translation of Malak was not to trap you or trick you--it was to simply get an answer from you. And your answer was more or less what I expected it would be, as I suspect that this is the core issue if misunderstanding.
The point isn't that Angelos was a translation of malak, or messenger--and therefore they aren't celestial beings. My point was that the areas where the Bible specifies Malak, they are referring to celestial beings--whose job it is to carry messages. Just as Cherubs are celestial beings, but whose job it is to guard the throne of El Elyon.
Both are celestial beings, but they have different jobs. What I am asserting, is not that these were not celestial beings, these malakim, but that malakim was conflated into a generic term for one of his divine servants.
Of these celestial beings, there are those who are treated as princes in the heavenly order. Those who are essentially ranked as you might find in a royal family. Whether this is literal or figurative, is unimportant. All that matters is that there was a hierarchy. And within that hierarchy, there are those who act as ministers, as princes, as accusers, as mediators, and as messengers. Some who act as soldiers and others who act as guardians. All part of a heavenly governing body.
So then, I take you back to where it all began. What is a god? What defines a god? Is it that it is worshipped? No, because not all deities that were ever imagined were deemed as something to worship. Is it power? No, because deities can range from ancestor worship to the Zeus. The key point on what a deity is, is that it is a spirit that can have a negative or positive impact upon the world.
So, a deity is not an explanation of one's nature, it is what one does. That is important, because without that key understanding, we'll be at odds. Now, I need to stress that simply because a spirit takes on the role of a deity, that does not equate it to El Elyon. For while a spirit is immortal, it does so at the sufferance at El Elyon. And it exists because it was created in the image of El Elyon, just as we were. (though in a different way) And El Elyon is eternal, because El Elyon has no creator. El Elyon is the originator of all things.
And that is what they are. For the Watchers did more than just bang a few women; they taught humans magic and forbidden knowledge. The Nephilim, thus being part celestial, part mortal--is a demigod. That is not a stretch of the word by any means. They were giants, yes--but then so were a set of gods in Norse Mythology, so that does not indicate a lack of divinity.
I am aware of that, am I not? Do you imagine that the Jews existed in a vacuum? The point of denouncing the Nephilim so strongly, is believed to have been commentary on the apkallu scholars, who claimed such ancestry to bolster their own reputations.
Yes, as you've told me several times. And for some reason, you seem to think you're the only one. I might remind you that, I am not the one who threw forward some half-ass, pagan BS about El Elyon being defeated by a mere lesser power? By butchering the biblical texts? By ignoring scripture that came before it on El Elyon's supreme power--and then imagining the immense stupidity of Jewish leaders not being able to spot the contradiction? Neither of us did that.
Shock as it might be to you,
I also read the bible. And it was apparent to me, even when I read it at a young age, that El Elyon had a divine council and he had other beings who did his bidding and at times, engaged in debate with each other at El Elyon's behest. The revelation that these rival gods were originally members of El Elyon's own council who had gone rogue, elevates the scripture and the supreme power of El Elyon,
it does not take away from it.
The point was never that there was no spirit named Baal Hedad or Chemosh--the point was that they were lesser to the One True God, El Elyon. YHWH.
Isaiah 45 NIV
And I think again, this is where the misunderstanding is. There are three divine rebellions against El Elyon.
There was the serpent, who brought death into the world and deceived Adam and Eve.
There were the Watchers, who took human wives, had bastard children, and taught men sorcery.
And there were the Elohim, the spirits that El Elyon had put in charge of the other nations--but instead of guiding them back toward El Elyon, instead of looking over them, they abused their positions and seduced men into worshiping them. (they, who were false)