Combat Reform Respect Thread: Only Real Experts Allowed

[Panzerkraken]

Couldn't the US , in a war situation, scramble the GPS system to where only the US and it's Allies can use it?

Short answer: Not anymore. 20 years ago, yes.

 

[Doomsought]

China has it's own GPS system (Baio) and so does Russia (Glonass), you either need active jamming to disrupt it locally or destroy the satelites.

If there isn't a binder somewhere with the exact set of orders needed to remove those within a few hours, then someone will be scrubbing the Pentagon bathrooms with his toothbrush when the time comes.

 

[PsihoKekec]

Sure there is a binder, but it relies on bunch of stuff that there ultimately wasn't budget for. You have the tech to reach satellites in any orbit, but the projects got cancelled for the most part and money spent elsewhere. Right now the most potent anti-satellite weapon in USA arsenal is the anti-ballistic missile for Aegis system, which can reach satellites in low orbit.

 

[paulobrito]

AFAIK ASAT weapons in use today are capable to hit low orbit sats, not the GEO ones like all GPS and GPS like ones.

 

[Sailor.X]

I will add that the US Navy needs to invest more in Corvette style ships. The last ones we had were technically the Cylcones. If we had more of these say about 50 to 100 we can provide the mainland and all of our territories with Surface Combatants patrol those waters. Frigates are all well and good but they are mean't to be with Battlegroups. Not stuck on coastal patrol duty.

 

[Zachowon]

just tell the Army there is oil on those ships and boats that have surface combatants and they will die by overwhelming Army firepower. Through raids by boats

 

[Sailor.X]

just tell the Army there is oil on those ships and boats that have surface combatants and they will die by overwhelming Army firepower. Through raids by boats

Greets Army Platoon on a Boarding Boat.

Hey y'all see that over there. That is the land. Y'all head that way. Boarding Teams is Boat Guy Turf.

 

[Bacle]

I will add that the US Navy needs to invest more in Corvette style ships. The last ones we had were technically the Cylcones. If we had more of these say about 50 to 100 we can provide the mainland and all of our territories with Surface Combatants patrol those waters. Frigates are all well and good but they are mean't to be with Battlegroups. Not stuck on coastal patrol duty.

Maybe just let the Coasties handle that, and commission a whole bunch of new build Revenue Cutters.

Same effect, but way less bearucratic hassle. Add a few deck-launch missiles for an additional punch against boghammers, maybe depth charges for near shore ASW, and you've got a good Corvette sized vessel with a logistics tail built in.

 

[Marduk]

I will add that the US Navy needs to invest more in Corvette style ships. The last ones we had were technically the Cylcones. If we had more of these say about 50 to 100 we can provide the mainland and all of our territories with Surface Combatants patrol those waters. Frigates are all well and good but they are mean't to be with Battlegroups. Not stuck on coastal patrol duty.

What potential conflict and likely opponent would US Navy need such ships against?

 

[Aaron Fox]

What potential conflict and likely opponent would US Navy need such ships against?

Any that requires ASW capability (which is, to say, a lot)? Given that the Benton-Woods system is breaking down, you're going to need those corvettes in escort duties because no one is going to be willing to trade anymore.

 

[Marduk]

Any that requires ASW capability (which is, to say, a lot)? Given that the Benton-Woods system is breaking down, you're going to need those corvettes in escort duties because no one is going to be willing to trade anymore.

That means needing oceanic endurance and sea handling capability...
And that means you may aswell make them frigates.

 

[Aaron Fox]

That means needing oceanic endurance and sea handling capability...
And that means you may aswell make them frigates.

It wouldn't be the first time we've up the size of a type of warship. There was a time where DDs were less than 5k tons at most. Now frigates are in light cruiser/very light heavy cruiser territory and DDGs are Washington Naval Treaty heavy cruisers in size and displacement.

 

[Sailor.X]

Maybe just let the Coasties handle that, and commission a whole bunch of new build Revenue Cutters.

Same effect, but way less bearucratic hassle. Add a few deck-launch missiles for an additional punch against boghammers, maybe depth charges for near shore ASW, and you've got a good Corvette sized vessel with a logistics tail built in.

Back during the Cold War the Coast Guard and the Navy both did this type of duty. And since we are gonna have China as a major rival in a few years. And we have a lot of territories in the Pacific. We need both Branches dong this duty.

What potential conflict and likely opponent would US Navy need such ships against?

China.

That means needing oceanic endurance and sea handling capability...
And that means you may aswell make them frigates.

We are building Frigates already. But with Coverttes you can crew them with just 25 Sailors. And you can build more of them for less for Coastal duties.

 

[Aaron Fox]

@Sailor.X, China becoming the US's rival won't be a thing for a few more decades, mostly due to the fact that their cash cow that is outsourcing is drying up and the fact that they're practically replacing their entire navy which is best described as 'green water' (i.e. coastal) for the most part.

The real problem is that Putin and associates want the USSR to come back and damn the costs to do so. For them, making everyone else agree that Russia must become the next Carthage as a best-case scenario for their defeat is acceptable for making Russia Great Again...

... without the current 'trade, or else' system in place, wars will become a thing again... and likely simply plunge the world into ceaseless war because that's how humans operate.

 

[Sailor.X]

@Sailor.X, China becoming the US's rival won't be a thing for a few more decades, mostly due to the fact that their cash cow that is outsourcing is drying up and the fact that they're practically replacing their entire navy which is best described as 'green water' (i.e. coastal) for the most part.

The real problem is that Putin and associates want the USSR to come back and damn the costs to do so. For them, making everyone else agree that Russia must become the next Carthage as a best-case scenario for their defeat is acceptable for making Russia Great Again...

... without the current 'trade, or else' system in place, wars will become a thing again... and likely simply plunge the world into ceaseless war because that's how humans operate.

The US as a favored trading partners days are gone and China killed it with Spying and the Wuhan Flu. We are not getting any containers from China at my warehouse. All of the suppliers have switched to Indonesia, India and Vietnam. That should tell you all you need to know.

 

[Aaron Fox]

The US as a favored trading partners days are gone and China killed it with Spying and the Wuhan Flu. We are not getting any containers from China at my warehouse. All of the suppliers have switched to Indonesia, India and Vietnam. That should tell you all you need to know.

Problem is, we need China to be invested into the system, and if there is no investment in the system then bad things happen.

 

[Sailor.X]

Problem is, we need China to be invested into the system, and if there is no investment in the system then bad things happen.

We don't need China. We did things for decades without them and we can do it again. We actually have Rare Earths and all the stuff we normally import from China on this Continent. Business people and Politicians closed those mines back during the 90s because they wanted cheap Chinese Labor to mine them.

 

[Marduk]

It wouldn't be the first time we've up the size of a type of warship. There was a time where DDs were less than 5k tons at most. Now frigates are in light cruiser/very light heavy cruiser territory and DDGs are Washington Naval Treaty heavy cruisers in size and displacement.

Reminder that we live in a time when steel is cheap but silicon is expensive.
So saving on warship size and being forced to miniaturize hi tech dependent capabilities, bad deal.

China.


We are building Frigates already. But with Coverttes you can crew them with just 25 Sailors. And you can build more of them for less for Coastal duties.

But would China send their painstakingly built up navy up to US coast to get scrapped by US land based aviation, while they have so many maritime claims in their nearby regions, which are why they are building up their navy in the first place?
Meanwhile coastal duties that aren't open naval combat are something USCG is better suited to handle.

 

[Aaron Fox]

We don't need China. We did things for decades without them and we can do it again. We actually have Rare Earths and all the stuff we normally import from China on this Continent. Business people and Politicians closed those mines back during the 90s because they wanted cheap Chinese Labor to mine them.

Here's the thing, historically the situation always has been what you can't get by trade, you have to get by conquest. By keeping China in the system, you don't have to fight them because they are part of the system and thus have a vested interest in keeping the system.

If China pulls out of the system, it will go out and start conquering places. That is a matter of if, not when.

Reminder that we live in a time when steel is cheap but silicon is expensive.
So saving on warship size and being forced to miniaturize hi tech dependent capabilities, bad deal.

Yes and that we're also having a problem that physics has a say in capability too. For example, our missiles aren't going to get any smaller because we can't get the reactions that propel our missiles and rockets to react faster, so to get more range/bigger payload/better sensors/mix of the above/all of the above, you have to make the missile bigger.

We're not Battletech where we can quite literally make the missile's frame basically C4-grade non-reactive explosive. We have to fit the warhead into the missile.

 

[Sailor.X]

But would China send their painstakingly built up navy up to US coast to get scrapped by US land based aviation, while they have so many maritime claims in their nearby regions, which are why they are building up their navy in the first place?
Meanwhile coastal duties that aren't open naval combat are something USCG is better suited to handle.

Again we have Pacific Territories that are far away from the Mainland. American Samoa is an example. Our major military assets are very far away and would take several weeks to get into place. China is closer to them than the US Mainland is.

We only have so many ships and so many planes and we can't protect everywhere without ships on site stationed there. Having several wolf packs of Corvettes at these far flung islands will be cost effective in keeping them safe until a few Battlegroups can get on station.

Here's the thing, historically the situation always has been what you can't get by trade, you have to get by conquest. By keeping China in the system, you don't have to fight them because they are part of the system and thus have a vested interest in keeping the system.

If China pulls out of the system, it will go out and start conquering places. That is a matter of if, not when.

Name one and I mean one war with a Modern Military that the PRC has won since it was formed. And no Tibet does not count. They have lost every single war they have started since the 1950s.