Carrot of Truth
War is Peace
Time to restore the Polish Lithuanian Commonwealth, Under a rightful monarch of course.
Restoring the Polish-Lithuanian Commenwealth Ideas
- Thread starter Carrot of Truth
- Start date
Time to restore the Polish Lithuanian Commonwealth, Under a rightful monarch of course.
TheRomanSlayer
Kayabangan, Dugo, at Dangal
There's the idea of the Intermarium project that Pilsudski wanted to build.
Thanks!
Which I already mentioned above and which is essentially just Mitteleuropa but without Germany and thus Polish-dominated rather than German-dominated.
So I nerded out for an hour while I was out and about and drummed up some stats about the modern Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth... it ain't Real Life Lore quality though... I just took all the states of Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Poland, Belarus and the Kaliningrad area (and ignored the bits that would've taken in Russia and Ukraine etc) to see what would turn up. Watched an excellent Resident Evil movie while compiling all of the numbers together as well.
Anyways... here's some rough stats... all from Wikipedia and using the latest census info they had on Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Kaliningrad, Poland and Belarus all being united into one modern Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth.
Total Population:
54,504,000
Total Land Area:
258,579 sq miles (barely larger then Afghanistan by 6000 sq miles!)
GDP Nominal:
916.725 Billion (19th after Netherlands but before Saudi Arabia)
$16,819 GDP/Per Person (54th after Uruguay but before Chile)
Largest Ethnic Groups:
38,832,800 Poles (71.2%)
9,164,000 Belarussians (16.8%)
2,600,800 Lithuanians (4.7%)
2,472,000 Russians (4.5%)
1,206,700 Latvians (2.2%)
916,700 Estonians (1.6%)
362,000 Silesians
305,000 Ukrainians
40,900 Germans
27,600 Jews
22,900 Roma
17,800 Tartars
Mother Language:
37,642,000 Polish (69%)
6,180,000 Russian (11.3%)
5,151,000 Belarussian (9.4%)
2,386,000 Lithuanian (4.3%)
1,283,000 Latvian (2.3%)
887,000 Estonian (1.6%)
56,000 Ukrainian
53,500 Silesian
Religion:
Catholic: 36,154,000 (66.3%)
Eastern Orthodox: 9,412,000 (17.2%)
Non-Religious: 3,064,000 (5.6%)
Protestant: 1,064,000 (1.9%)
Muslims: 23,000
Top Twelve Largest Cities:
Minsk: 1,993,000 (Belarus)
Warsaw: 1,794,000 (Poland)
Krakow: 781,000 (Poland)
Vilnius: 707,000 (Lithuania)
Lodz: 677,000 (Poland)
Wroclaw: 644,000 (Poland)
Riga: 634,000 (Latvia)
Homyel: 536,000 (Belarus)
Poznan: 534,000 (Poland)
Kaliningrad: 475,000 (Kaliningrad)
Gdansk: 472,000 (Poland)
Tallinn: 431,000 (Estonia)
Anyways... here's some rough stats... all from Wikipedia and using the latest census info they had on Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Kaliningrad, Poland and Belarus all being united into one modern Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth.
Total Population:
54,504,000
Total Land Area:
258,579 sq miles (barely larger then Afghanistan by 6000 sq miles!)
GDP Nominal:
916.725 Billion (19th after Netherlands but before Saudi Arabia)
$16,819 GDP/Per Person (54th after Uruguay but before Chile)
Largest Ethnic Groups:
38,832,800 Poles (71.2%)
9,164,000 Belarussians (16.8%)
2,600,800 Lithuanians (4.7%)
2,472,000 Russians (4.5%)
1,206,700 Latvians (2.2%)
916,700 Estonians (1.6%)
362,000 Silesians
305,000 Ukrainians
40,900 Germans
27,600 Jews
22,900 Roma
17,800 Tartars
Mother Language:
37,642,000 Polish (69%)
6,180,000 Russian (11.3%)
5,151,000 Belarussian (9.4%)
2,386,000 Lithuanian (4.3%)
1,283,000 Latvian (2.3%)
887,000 Estonian (1.6%)
56,000 Ukrainian
53,500 Silesian
Religion:
Catholic: 36,154,000 (66.3%)
Eastern Orthodox: 9,412,000 (17.2%)
Non-Religious: 3,064,000 (5.6%)
Protestant: 1,064,000 (1.9%)
Muslims: 23,000
Top Twelve Largest Cities:
Minsk: 1,993,000 (Belarus)
Warsaw: 1,794,000 (Poland)
Krakow: 781,000 (Poland)
Vilnius: 707,000 (Lithuania)
Lodz: 677,000 (Poland)
Wroclaw: 644,000 (Poland)
Riga: 634,000 (Latvia)
Homyel: 536,000 (Belarus)
Poznan: 534,000 (Poland)
Kaliningrad: 475,000 (Kaliningrad)
Gdansk: 472,000 (Poland)
Tallinn: 431,000 (Estonia)
Total Population:
1.328 million Estonia
1.908 million Latvia
2.796 million Lithuania
942,000 Thousand Kaliningrad
9.350 million Belarus
38,180 million Poland
Area:
17,505 sq miles
24,938 sq miles
25,200 sq miles
5800 sq miles
80,153 sq miles
120,733 sq miles
Largest Ethnic Groups:
Estonians 915,000 + 1700 + 0 + 0 + 0 + 0
Russians 323,000 + 487,000 + 177,000 + 773,000 + 707,000 + 5000
Ukrainians 27,000 + 43,000 + 16,000 + 33,000 + 160,000 + 26,000
Belarussians 11,000 + 63,000 + 36,000 + 32,000 + 7,991,000 + 31,000
Latvians 3500 +1,203,000 + 200 + 0 + 0 + 0
Germans 2500 + 2500 + 2400 + 7500 + 0 + 26,000
Lithuanian 2000 + 23,000 + 2,561,000 + 9800 + 5000 + 0
Jews 2000 + 4700 + 3000 + 0 + 13500 + 7400
Poles 2000 + 40,000 + 200,000 + 2800 + 288,000 + 38,300,000
Tartars 2000 + 0 + 2800 + 4500 + 8500 + 0
Roma 0 + 5000 + 2100 + 0 + 6800 + 9000
Silesians 0 + 0 + 0 + 0 + 0 + 362,000
Language:
Latvian: 0 + 1,283,000 + 0 + 0 + 0 + 0
Estonian: 887,000 + 0 + 0 + 0 + 0 + 0
Russian: 383,000 + 669,000 + 202,000 + 942,000 + 3,984,000 + 0
Lithuanian: 0 + 0 + 2,386,000 + 0 + 0 + 0
Polish 0 + 0 + 149,000 + 0 + 0 + 37,493,000
Belarussian 0 + 0 + 56,000 + 0 + 5,095,000 + 0
Ukrainian 0 + 0 + 56,000 + 0 + 0 + 0
Silesian 0 + 0 + 0 + 0 + 0 + 53500
Religion:
Non-Religious 500,000 + 406,000 + 556,000 + 524,000 + 734,000 + 344,000
Eastern Orthodox 209,000 + 370,000 + 123,000 + 296,000 + 7.907,000 + 507,000
Protestant 139,000 + 720,000 + 23,000 + 1000 + 94,000 + 86000
Catholic 6000 + 500,000 + 2,085,000 + 1000 + 631,000 + 32,931,000
Muslims 1300 + 0 + 2100 + 0 + 19,000 + 500
Total Nominal GDP (billions):
35.187 Estonia
40.830 Latvia
56.000 Lithuania
7.000 Kaliningrad
57.708 Belarus
720.000 Poland
1.328 million Estonia
1.908 million Latvia
2.796 million Lithuania
942,000 Thousand Kaliningrad
9.350 million Belarus
38,180 million Poland
Area:
17,505 sq miles
24,938 sq miles
25,200 sq miles
5800 sq miles
80,153 sq miles
120,733 sq miles
Largest Ethnic Groups:
Estonians 915,000 + 1700 + 0 + 0 + 0 + 0
Russians 323,000 + 487,000 + 177,000 + 773,000 + 707,000 + 5000
Ukrainians 27,000 + 43,000 + 16,000 + 33,000 + 160,000 + 26,000
Belarussians 11,000 + 63,000 + 36,000 + 32,000 + 7,991,000 + 31,000
Latvians 3500 +1,203,000 + 200 + 0 + 0 + 0
Germans 2500 + 2500 + 2400 + 7500 + 0 + 26,000
Lithuanian 2000 + 23,000 + 2,561,000 + 9800 + 5000 + 0
Jews 2000 + 4700 + 3000 + 0 + 13500 + 7400
Poles 2000 + 40,000 + 200,000 + 2800 + 288,000 + 38,300,000
Tartars 2000 + 0 + 2800 + 4500 + 8500 + 0
Roma 0 + 5000 + 2100 + 0 + 6800 + 9000
Silesians 0 + 0 + 0 + 0 + 0 + 362,000
Language:
Latvian: 0 + 1,283,000 + 0 + 0 + 0 + 0
Estonian: 887,000 + 0 + 0 + 0 + 0 + 0
Russian: 383,000 + 669,000 + 202,000 + 942,000 + 3,984,000 + 0
Lithuanian: 0 + 0 + 2,386,000 + 0 + 0 + 0
Polish 0 + 0 + 149,000 + 0 + 0 + 37,493,000
Belarussian 0 + 0 + 56,000 + 0 + 5,095,000 + 0
Ukrainian 0 + 0 + 56,000 + 0 + 0 + 0
Silesian 0 + 0 + 0 + 0 + 0 + 53500
Religion:
Non-Religious 500,000 + 406,000 + 556,000 + 524,000 + 734,000 + 344,000
Eastern Orthodox 209,000 + 370,000 + 123,000 + 296,000 + 7.907,000 + 507,000
Protestant 139,000 + 720,000 + 23,000 + 1000 + 94,000 + 86000
Catholic 6000 + 500,000 + 2,085,000 + 1000 + 631,000 + 32,931,000
Muslims 1300 + 0 + 2100 + 0 + 19,000 + 500
Total Nominal GDP (billions):
35.187 Estonia
40.830 Latvia
56.000 Lithuania
7.000 Kaliningrad
57.708 Belarus
720.000 Poland
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I suspect that Belarusians could become Polonized relatively easily given enough time. Was easier to do when they were less literate, but probably still doable even nowadays. Interestingly enough, even right now, there are still some Poles in Belarus:
That's 2019 data, BTW.
I suspect that Belarusians could become Polonized relatively easily given enough time. Was easier to do when they were less literate, but probably still doable even nowadays. Interestingly enough, even right now, there are still some Poles in Belarus:
That's 2019 data, BTW.
Yeah Poland looks pretty dominant demographically. Which is to be expected I suppose. They make up like 2/3rds to 3/4's of everything from population to language to GDP. Half of the top twelve biggest cities are Polish and IIRC it'd be more Polish lopsided if the list of urban centers was even larger. I was surprised to see more Lithuanians then Russians in the Commonwealth however. So Lithuania is still kinda there a bit. Plus they are almost tied for the second biggest economy after Belarus.
Maybe I can do military inventory next if there's any interest!
Yes, please do!
BTW, you might be interested in this:
Comprehensive Military Power: World\'s Top 10 Militaries of 2015
It is in some ways remarkable that there is still no commonly agreed method on quantifying and ranking national military power. There is one such for economics, for instance. It is called the GDP. You can make somewhat different arguments on relative economic size or living standards based on...
www.unz.com
CMP Update: World's Top 10 Militaries of 2021
In 2015, I attempted to quantify the military power of the world's states with an index of Comprehensive Military Power. You can read the post, including the detailed methodology, here. Since then, its conclusions - broadly speaking, that China and Russia had about a third of US military power...
www.unz.com
It was possible with Belarus,and all baltic states except Lithuania.
They hate poles to the point,where they are capable of supporting basically everybody against us.If martians land and start killing humanity,they would help them as long as martians would kill poles first.
They hate poles to the point,where they are capable of supporting basically everybody against us.If martians land and start killing humanity,they would help them as long as martians would kill poles first.
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Carrot of Truth
War is Peace
Buba
A total creep
Absolutely not!
On this I agree. Of course, first a Civil War to decide who the rightful monarch is.
The way I see things Lithuanian national identity is built upon hatred towards Poland.
Basically it was a choice between Polonophobia or assimilation into a Polish identity.
But it is complicated.
There were 1st cousins at ministerial posts in the 2nd Republic and in Lithuania ...
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Becouse lithuanians was created by germans as artifical nation to be used both again Russia and poles before WW1,and germans made them polish-hating to made sure,that they always remain their tool.
Which is still working.Even now they still not lend polish minority there have its own names,but changed it to lithuanians.
They were angry at the Poles for stealing Vilnius from them. Vilnius was Lithuania's historic capital even though it was full of Poles and had few Lithuanians until WWII.
Carrot of Truth
War is Peace
Well fuck a new commonwealth would be great hate boners aside
Vilnius can be made its capital so that both Poles and Lithuanians can feel like winners. And Vilnius could be an independent capital city similar to Washington, DC.
It was never lithuanian land - first people there was belarussian,poles come later,lithuanians during WW2.
It was capitol of old Lithuania - but old lithuania was state made from russian states which do not wonted mongols and Moscow,with lithuanians becoming minority even among elites which created that state.
And modern lithuanian nations was made by germans before WW1,and in 1914 it was maybe 500 persons.Others who speakes lithuanians local languages/there was no one language/ considered themselves locals.
So,lithuanians was german project,and they are still just that.