Starship Troopers general thread

[Flintsteel]

Okay seriously, if you're going to make complaints, at least be correct.

The only branch we know practices enlisted-to-office only is the MI. The Navy does not, as Carmen goes straight to officer without being enlisted. It's an MI thing, not a Service in general thing.

The Navy is not female-only. The MI is male-only, but they're a ground-pounder force with strict physical standards. 99% of women wouldn't be able to make it through MI boot.

As to Rico's father, he appears to have made either corporal or sergeant straight out of boot, unlike Rico himself. Rico explicitly notes that his father would have managed to not make the same screw-ups he did in training which got his training stripes yanked. His father made platoon sergeant fast, and likely could have taken OCS... but it seems obvious he wanted to stay with his son, and thus would have turned it down.


People really need to remember that Starship Troopers is very narrowly-focused on Rico & his journey, and does not actually give a good view of the entire Federal Service.

 

[FriedCFour]

Maybe it was just Heinlein showing how woke he was. I mean, the MI is all male and the Navy is all female so logically speaking the Sky Marshal has to be Trans by definition...

The navy isn’t all female either. I think that’s just pilots lol

 

[Husky_Khan]

Archcast did a great video takedown of some nitwit journalists trying to dissemble Starship Troopers.



This one comes from the geniuses at some website called The Ringer.

‘Starship Troopers’ Was Ahead of the Curve

The sci-fi film’s cautionary tale about reckless militarism and the dangers of fascism feels even more relevant today than it did when the movie was released 25 years ago

www.theringer.com

Here's one of the many "arguments" that the journalist makes in the article that Arch Warhammer skewers.

The citizen-civilian dynamic is essentially a futuristic caste system: only citizens, for instance, have the right to vote. (What little is known about civilians in the movie suggests they barely have autonomy under the Federation.) To become a citizen, a person must complete service in the military, which, while not technically mandatory, is seared into the minds of younger generations as a noble pursuit by hawkish teachers.

Yeah remember when Rico's parents with their fancy wealthy house in an idyllic Rio De Janeiro community were living as marginalized civilians with barely any autonomy apparently?

Anyways... fun video for background watching. I do think this journalist is a species traitor though with this final line:

the only real victory of note is when humans capture a “brain bug” that directs swarms of Arachnids, and begin probing the poor thing with phallic instruments.

Poor thing? They wiped out Buenos Aires! I say PHALLIC PROBING IS TOO GOOD FOR THEM!

 

[Firebat]

They wiped out Buenos Aires!

Eh, the film is not exactly subtle about who has done BA in.

 

[Husky_Khan]

Eh, the film is not exactly subtle about who has done BA in.

Still not canon. Just a theory.

 

[Firebat]

Still not canon.

The only thing that's canon is the fact that BA (and three other places, I think?) went up in smoke.
The rest of Federation's story about bugs and asteroids is just that - an in-universe story.

 

[Battlegrinder]

The only thing that's canon is the fact that BA (and three other places, I think?) went up in smoke.
The rest of Federation's story about bugs and asteroids is just that - an in-universe story.

Yes, and across multiple films, the animated movies, the new game, and who knows what other media, there's never been a shred of additional evidence for the false flag theory, despite those same works repeatedly painted the federation in a poor light. Nor had there been any compelling reason given for why they would do so.

Meanwhile, there is ample evidence that the bugs possess both the means and the malice needed to launch such an attack.

 

[Firebat]

Yes, and across multiple films, the animated movies, the new game, and who knows what other media

I don't see what does it matter.
The "franchise", such as it is, has never had any kind of unified creative vision of the universe, be it Verhoeven's or someone else's. People holding the rights just tried to cash in as best as they were able, making B-movies and what not. Using them to discuss the original film is just as absurd as trying to use Amazon's Rings of Power to discuss the Silmarillion.

 

[Urabrask Revealed]

I don't see what does it matter.
The "franchise", such as it is, has never had any kind of unified creative vision of the universe, be it Verhoeven's or someone else's. People holding the rights just tried to cash in as best as they were able, making B-movies and what not. Using them to discuss the original film is just as absurd as trying to use Amazon's Rings of Power to discuss the Silmarillion.

And of course that makes your theory of the Federation performing a false flag on Buero Aires true. Not how it works, man.

 

[Battlegrinder]

I don't see what does it matter.
The "franchise", such as it is, has never had any kind of unified creative vision of the universe, be it Verhoeven's or someone else's. People holding the rights just tried to cash in as best as they were able, making B-movies and what not. Using them to discuss the original film is just as absurd as trying to use Amazon's Rings of Power to discuss the Silmarillion.

Even going off of only the first film, you're no better off. You still have no evidence the federation actually did it (merely the somewhat shaky claim that they could have), nor a motive for them to have done it.

"The federation launched the asteroid" is a fan theory in the same vein as all those "X character is just dead and in a coma, and everything that happened in the show is just a dream" fan """theories""" that crop up all the time. Yes, it's technically possibly, but the case for it is entirely non diegetic.

 

[Firebat]

You still have no evidence the federation actually did it

There is no evidence the bugs actually did it either, merely Federation's very shaky claim that they did.
And Federation's story has more holes in it than the Swiss cheese.

nor a motive for them to have done it

The movie begins with militaristic society in which older generation of citizens has bought into state ideology, while the next batch of potential citizens couldn't give a rat's ass. Michael Ironside asks MC to recite the party line and he does. Michael Ironside then asks whether MC believes in party line, and MC does not. MC and his peers are going through the motions of service not out of genuine dedication, but for the perks. To become citizen, to get education, to get birthing permit...
For now, the state can make people recite the words and jump through the hoops. But it has no future because the next generation is apathetic. If people like Rico grow old enough to take Michael Ironside's place, the Federation is done for. In fact, by the time of Buenos Aires, Rico doesn't even want to jump through the hoops anymore.

The movie ends with new generation fully remolded by the war into perfect tin soldiers the Federation wants them to be. They all proudly put on Nazis uniforms, cheerfully tattoo Totenkopfs on their arms and are ready murder anyone the state points them to with enthusiasm of true believers. The unfit are weeded away, the survivors are full of zeal and hate. Rico has become Michael Ironside.

Happy End.

the case for it is entirely non diegetic

You are saying it like it's a bad thing. A movie is no book, it does not exist on script alone.

 

[Carrot of Truth]

Here is the audiobook.

 

[Battlegrinder]

There is no evidence the bugs actually did it either, merely Federation's very shaky claim that they did.
And Federation's story has more holes in it than the Swiss cheese.

The big theory requires the bugs, who are obviously in possession of FTL capability, use that ability to lob an asteroid at Earth, in response to what they perceived as violations of thier territory by the federation. That's 100% consistent with what we see in the film.

The movie begins with militaristic society

No it doesn't.

in which older generation of citizens has bought into state ideology, while the next batch of potential citizens couldn't give a rat's ass. Michael Ironside asks MC to recite the party line and he does. Michael Ironside then asks whether MC believes in party line, and MC does not. MC and his peers are going through the motions of service not out of genuine dedication, but for the perks. To become citizen, to get education, to get birthing permit...

For now, the state can make people recite the words and jump through the hoops. But it has no future because the next generation is apathetic. If people like Rico grow old enough to take Michael Ironside's place, the Federation is done for.

You're grossly overgeneralizing the opinion of the entire society based only on the opinion of one slacker just out of high school, who was only one of dozens of people we saw joining up, and them jumping to wild conclusions based on nothing.

Also, it's not surprising that the guys just out of high school are immature and more interested in perks than ideals. Have you ever meet an 18 year old? Rasczak was the same as Rico when he was Rico's age, if that's when he signed up. Learning the value of those ideals is the entire point of making citizenship conditional.

Nor is Rico's lackluster civic virtue unique, as you might recall his parents are only civilians and disdain citizenship as a waste. Clearly, the previous generation was not just a bunch of Rasczaks, and things are running just fine, there is no valid reason to assume society is crumbling.

In fact, by the time of Buenos Aires, Rico doesn't even want to jump through the hoops anymore.

Yes, Rico was about to quit.....how many other people in his unit had thrown in the towel?

The movie ends with new generation fully remolded by the war into perfect tin soldiers the Federation wants them to be. They all proudly put on Nazis uniforms, cheerfully tattoo Totenkopfs on their arms and are ready murder anyone the state points them to with enthusiasm of true believers. The unfit are weeded away, the survivors are full of zeal and hate. Rico has become Michael Ironside.

Happy End.

Ok, Mr Verhoeven, take it down a notice.

You are saying it like it's a bad thing. A movie is no book, it does not exist on script alone.

No, but your understanding of a story should be informed by the story alone, not the story + whatever BS Paul Verhoeven spun up to make this sound like some genius satire and not the studio slapping some new names on an unrelated script to cash in on the license.

 

[Typhonis]

Fun fact, there is a prequal comic for Starship troopers where we learn how Ironside's character lost his arm. Needless to say the Bug knew about the Federation for over a decade at least.

Starship Troopers Insect Touch.

 

[Carrot of Truth]

Fun fact, there is a prequal comic for Starship troopers where we learn how Ironside's character lost his arm. Needless to say the Bug knew about the Federation for over a decade at least.

Starship Troopers Insect Touch.

Well that and the bugs had regularly been launching asteroids at Earth for some time, The one that hit only did so because their defense systems failed to shoot it for some reason.

 

[Aldarion]

Few videos by Arch to start off:

 

[ATP]

Book is very good.
Movie ruined it,turning normal society into fascist parody.
Cartoons - dunno,i watched only few.

 

[Husky_Khan]

Roughnecks is pretty high quality for Western Kids Animation. I'd put it on a similar level to like Exo-Squad or the like. If it had more time to be seasoned, it'd be top tier. The show was good but it was obviously stripped down of much of the political/social commentary that you see in the book and movie.

 

[ATP]

Roughnecks is pretty high quality for Western Kids Animation. I'd put it on a similar level to like Exo-Squad or the like. If it had more time to be seasoned, it'd be top tier. The show was good but it was obviously stripped down of much of the political/social commentary that you see in the book and movie.

So,i would not get knowledge about their society there.
Still better then movie,when we get fake knowledge.

 

[Husky_Khan]

So,i would not get knowledge about their society there.
Still better then movie,when we get fake knowledge.

Taking an "apolitical" stance regarding military events is a pretty common thing of course. It was actually a theme of Ridley Scott's Black Hawk Down in how apolitical a lot of the soldiers were and emphasizing the brotherhood/fraternity amongst those serving together. And it's a pretty common theme in movies and books fictional and non-fiction in general.

So while learning about the Terran Federations broader society would be neat, it's not particularly an outlier for not focusing much on it since far more "adult" oriented military shows and movies do the same thing.

Plus we've seen how the Starship Troopers sequels treat Terran Federation society. When it's not cringe, it's almost too hilarious to even be considered proper satire unlike the first film.