Would Germany and/or Italy have ever actually unified if it wasn't for the 1789 French Revolution?
- Thread starter WolfBear
- Start date
TheRejectionist
TheRejectionist
Maybe?
Both Bismarck and Garibaldi weren't actually born yet. Neither was Cavour:
Camillo Benso, Count of Cavour - Wikipedia
Would others have taken their place? And would the various European Great Powers have actually agreed to German and Italian unification without the French Revolution?
Sooner or later.
Every country in the world goes through cycles of unification and fragmentation, civil war and expansion, only thing is that some phases are longer than others.
Every country in the world goes through cycles of unification and fragmentation, civil war and expansion, only thing is that some phases are longer than others.
History Learner
Well-known member
In the 1770s-1780s Prussia had constructed a pretty serious Proto-NGF and was seriously girding itself for a final showdown with the Austrians until France blew up on everyone. Had France remained moribund because of domestic issues-and thus unable to intervene-but not an active threat in the way it became, it's likely we would've got an explosive engagement between Prussia and Austria in the 1790s that could've provoked German unification decades ahead of schedule.
But what if Austria would have won this engagement?
History Learner
Well-known member
I've never directly studied it, but my understanding is they were militarily not ready for such and their attention was also divided between Germany and the Balkans at this time.
Interesting. Would a German unification around 1800 have also excluded Austria? Because 1800 Prussia had no problem with having a lot of Catholic subjects, as evidenced by its extremely massive chunk of Poland, even including Warsaw!
History Learner
Well-known member
I'm expecting Little Germany still, the other Great Powers wouldn't want a Super Large Germany.
What about Italian unification?
sillygoose
Well-known member
Prussian military reforms would likely not happen, as they were directly related to the defeat in 1806 and the Napoleonic Wars giving rise to the highly professional general staff, which hadn't really existed except as a theory by Scharnhorst and his circle, who in turn only had a chance to enact those reforms after the crushing defeat forced the king to look for any way to modernize the military.
History Learner
Well-known member
Prussian military capabilities declined greatly after the 1780s into the first decade of the 1800s, they were basically running on reputation by that point after the machine Old Fritz and his father had built declined after the former's death.
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Was Frederick the Great's successor particularly incompetent from a military perspective? Because Prussia completed the partitions of Poland under his watch.
That was more of a win of geopolitics, than a sign of Prussian martial greatness. Poland at this point was shattered and surrounded by enemies on all sides with a mediocre army and political instability abound.