As it applies to school choice, yes.
The Right and White Nationalism - An annoying cancer
- Thread starter Bacle
- Start date
strunkenwhite
Well-known member
"This time communism will work!"
KilroywasNOTHere
"BEEP!"
Isin't one of the keystone narrtives of judasim and christianity is that the whole modern human species came from 8 people? Somthing about a big ark and a flood that wiped out the whole earth save for the people on the ark? That's kind of a big detail, or are we just going to take bits and pecies of the new testament when it suits us?
Yep, because they are dealing with a long telephone-game retelling of the opening of the Aegean Sea into the Black Sea, and don't want to admit it.
King Arts
Well-known member
Yes all men are brothers . God also gave certain lands to Shem, others to Japheth, and Ham got other places. Not to mention the whole Tower of Babel which happened later. You can be ethno nationalist and still Christian. Ethno nationalism is not the same as racism or Nazism.
KilroywasNOTHere
"BEEP!"
and yet the bible in the new testament also encourages people to marry within the lord not just their own races and specifically not show preferences due to outward stuff like skin color. Ethno nationalist seem to make the mistake of saying that skin color= ideology which is weird because frankly no one has bent the white man over like white men has, especially in the 21st century.
you guys are so busy protesting about how your not a nazi (we get it your not a nazi, contray to what the left thinks that's a very low bar), you don't dress the other issues with your ideology.
King Arts
Well-known member
Ethno nationalism has very little to do with skin color. Russians and poles are both white yet are different ethnic groups. They have different culture and different religion. Or here is another example that could piss people off. Modern day Turks are barely related to the ancient Turkic people. Ancient Turks were asiatic like mongols. Modern Turks are close genetically to modern Greeks. A Turk is basically a Greek who abandoned his religion and culture of his ancestors to the religion and culture of his conquerors. Ethnicity is much more than genes someone with the same genes as you can be your complete opposite.
DocSolarisReich
Esoteric Spaceman
Where does Christ or his Church teach that ethnicity or nations or race or language are invalid categories that the faithful are forbidden to use to organize around?
Protip: Nowhere. The Orthodox Church is in fact organized around national and ethnic jurisdictional authority structures.
Bear Ribs
Well-known member
You cannot be for or against one race and follow God.
34 Peter said, “I really am learning that God doesn’t show partiality to one group of people over another. 35 Rather, in every nation, whoever worships him and does what is right is acceptable to him.
Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,
“After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;”
34 Peter said, “I really am learning that God doesn’t show partiality to one group of people over another. 35 Rather, in every nation, whoever worships him and does what is right is acceptable to him.
Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,
“After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;”
KilroywasNOTHere
"BEEP!"
how exacly does that help your argument, you've essentially just admited that Humans have interbreed. So much for entho purity. If you really are all gun hoe for this, then go or stay in the land of your ansetors and don't trsavel anywhere.
Galatians 3
1O foolish Galatians! Who has bewitched you [a]that you should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ was clearly portrayed https://biblehub.com/nkjv/galatians/3.htm#footnotesamong you as crucified? 2This only I want to learn from you: Did you receive the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? 3Are you so foolish? Having begun in the Spirit, are you now being made perfect by the flesh? 4Have you suffered so [c]many things in vain—if indeed it was in vain?
5Therefore He who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles among you, does He do it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?— 6just as Abraham “believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.” 7Therefore know that only those who are of faith are sons of Abraham. 8And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel to Abraham beforehand, saying, “In you all the nations shall be blessed.” 9So then those who are of faith are blessed with believing Abraham.
The Law Brings a Curse
10For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them.” 11But that no one is [d]justified by the law in the sight of God is evident, for “the just shall live by faith.” 12Yet the law is not of faith, but “the man who does them shall live by them.”
13Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us (for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree”), 14that the blessing of Abraham might come upon the Gentiles in Christ Jesus, that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.
The Changeless Promise
15Brethren, I speak in the manner of men: Though it is only a man’s covenant, yet if it is confirmed, no one annuls or adds to it. 16Now to Abraham and his Seed were the promises made. He does not say, “And to seeds,” as of many, but as of one, “And to your Seed,” who is Christ. 17And this I say, that the law, which was four hundred and thirty years later, cannot annul the covenant that was confirmed before by God [e]in Christ, that it should make the promise of no effect. 18For if the inheritance is of the law, it is no longer of promise; but God gave it to Abraham by promise.
Purpose of the Law
19What purpose then does the law serve? It was added because of transgressions, till the Seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was appointed through angels by the hand of a mediator. 20Now a mediator does not mediate for one only, but God is one.
21Is the law then against the promises of God? Certainly not! For if there had been a law given which could have given life, truly righteousness would have been by the law. 22But the Scripture has confined all under sin, that the promise by faith in Jesus Christ might be given to those who believe. 23But before faith came, we were kept under guard by the law, [f]kept for the faith which would afterward be revealed. 24Therefore the law was our [g]tutor to bring us to Christ, that we might be justified by faith. 25But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor.
Sons and Heirs
26For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. 27For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. 28There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29And if you are Christ’s, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.
DocSolarisReich
Esoteric Spaceman
26For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. 27For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ. 28There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29And if you are Christ’s, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.
Fail. This passage has never been taken to mean that men and women don't actually exist any more than nations. Do try to remember that the vast majority of Christians do not subscribe to the defined and condemned heresy of Sola Scriptura.
KilroywasNOTHere
"BEEP!"
then you and I have nothing to discuss pal.
King Arts
Well-known member
Umm ethno nationalism doesn’t require racial purity. I doubt there even is such a thing. It calls for following the ways of your ancestors aka cultural purity which would also lead to religious purity for historically Christian nations.
Morphic Tide
Well-known member
I'll quote the post that began this particular bit from me, to show the statement I was arguing against:
As you can see, it is specifically attributing genocide to the extensively overarching label of "White", which we agree is beyond the scope of ethnicity. I'm not letting the lot of you juggle goalposts freely, either there's a pan-European identity you're defending, or you're defending specific ethnicities. Pick one, and make sure you stick with it. No jumping on people arguing against the other as if attacking yours.
Citation on ancient Persia actually maintaining ethnic purity? To my understanding, states have always had their populations blend over time, unless they actively try to suppress travel. The whole thing with millions upon millions of Asians being descended from Ghengis Khan comes to mind, and both Rome and the Mongols actually engaged in rampant theft of cultural properties to fuel their conquest (much more the latter from all the things they needed to get to bootstrap from nomad horse-archers to dealing with walled cities and trans-Eurasian trade)
...So are we just ignoring how "Hispanic" became a thing from the Muslim conquest of the Iberian Peninsula or "Latino" from the previous conquering Central America? Or how it is Europeans have a lot of Neanderthal traits? The actual difference of the modern case is that it isn't an open violent conquest, as was the historic norm, but rather the peaceful migrants are being allowed to integrate and do so in large enough quantities to truly blend ethnicities from it. Which, to my understanding, was actually a thing in Rome and the Mongolian Empire, as well as most of the Chinese Dynasties, to a much greater net effect than modern times have had so far.
Minor correction, it's more that the science has shown it can't be a significant percentile difference outside very extreme conditions like chromosome duplication (Down's Syndrome) or genetic breakdown from exceptionally large mutations (Fragile X Syndrome). Environmental factors constantly come up as massively overpowering existent genetic divergence of humans.
Fun fact, you directly quoting verses is Sola Scriptura. To not be engaged in it, you must be quoting members of the Clergy themselves rather than scripture, as holding it as heresy means that independent reading of the scripture is not theologically valid, and therefor one must specifically appeal to established authority's readings rather than the text of scripture.
If you are going to state a standard required for a position to be valid, I'm going to demand you hold to that standard.
Aldarion
Neoreactionary Monarchist
Except that was never the case. If you study Byzantine Empire, you will notice that pre-Roman languages and pre-Christ religions (something Byzantines did not take kindly) actually survived until 9th or 10th century, in both Peloponnese and Asia Minor. And they did so because people simply didn't intermingle at large level, so they easily slipped past (with the exception of big cities). In Western Roman Empire people did not really blend either; in fact, Romans (and post-Roman governments) actively discouraged migration because it made tracking of tax and population records rather difficult.
Travel technology was primitive enough that, with exception of large ports, they did not need to suppress travel for it to not happen. Theft of cultural properties was a big thing (mostly in regards to religion, but even there - see above), but what happened was cultural appropriation and mixture - not a physical one.
First, "Hispanic" was a thing from Roman times. It was a geographic determination.
Second, cultural changes do not indicate genetic changes. Culture changed, but population stayed the same.
Third, Europeans having a "lot" of Neanderthal traits is simply wrong. Yes, there are some, but Neanderthals were simply outbred.
As for Rome, Mongolia and China "blending ethnicities" - never happened. They did blend cultures to an extent, but ethnicites stayed separate.
King Arts
Well-known member
But that’s not what sola scriptura means. Someone rejecting sola scripture does not mean that you can’t read and cite scripture. It means that there is more than just the Bible for Christian practice, and also that learned church men are needed to translate and interpret. It doesn’t mean you can’t interpret some easy verses. For example thou shall not steal is simple and you can get it. But there are some passages that have multiple meanings that not everyone can pick up. For example when it says do not put stumbling blocks in front of the blind there is the obvious prohibition of bullying a blind person but there are also subtle messages there.
DocSolarisReich
Esoteric Spaceman
Although seeing GB what Protestarts and fedora tippers have done with the Word, maybe translating it from Latin, Greek, and Church Slavonic was a bad idea.
They have more than anyone else, and it's because Neanderthals interbred with the post-Ice Age waves of African/ME sourced people.
There were multiple waves of paleo-migrations from Africa, with the Ice Age providing the largest gap, which resulted in previous waves in Europe and Asia differentiating into Neanderthals and Denisovans subspecies that were then folded back into the main human gene pool after the Ice Age.
Aldarion
Neoreactionary Monarchist
Relative to other human populations, yes. I was talking more about overall genome.
Morphic Tide
Well-known member
Citations, please? Particularly on the ones I actually mentioned as sources of ethnic mixture, which did not include Rome. I know perfectly well that Rome actually did have specific measures to stem interbreeding and mentioned such measures as a source of exceptions, which you agreed to the presence of.
On the scale of literal centuries, the occasional merchant does, in fact, constitute ethnic blending. Major inter-regional crossroads have a tendency for this to be obvious in their demography. Travel technologies enable a larger scale of reasonable interbreeding, but then the large ports you mention were the lifeblood of basically every Empire ever to wrap a meaningful portion of the Mediteranian meaning your "exceptions" constituted most meaningful urban areas.
Doc has been engaged in purity spiral bullshit in huge swaths of their posts, going full "There Is Only One Church" on more than one occasion. They want to bring up layman interpretations of scripture not being valid, I'm going to demand them be an absolute hardass about it because they are already an absolute hardass about a great deal.
No citing the New Testament saying the old covenant is abrogated except for sexual taboos, actually pull up the Clergy's conclusions of exactly what parts are retained to substantiate the claim.