Hamas Launches Offensive Against Southern Israel

Abhorsen said:
Honestly, I think (again, barring an impossible Egypt deal) Fatah is the best bet. It's the finishing blow on Hamas once they are crippled: putting their bitter rivals in power over the area to complete the stamping out. What can rise there afterwards? Not Hamas, at least.
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There's still the leftover Palestinian leftist groups that can also cause trouble. Though I'm not sure how much effective are they.
 
Jormungandr said:
Iran won't do fuck all over its "red line". The moment they try anything, those US carriers and cruisers will bomb them to scrap -- especially their oil refineries.

They're not going to risk anything for the Palestinians, no matter what their version of an ITG from the UN says.
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Idk, we will see once the ground invasion starts
 
Zachowon said:
Idk, we will see once the ground invasion starts
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Zach, be serious: Do you really think Iran would gamble and lose it all against Israel and the United States for the most hated group in the Middle-East (well, outside of being Jewish, I guess)? That it'd gamble its essential oil infrastructure? That it doesn't know that the miles on miles of (rumoured?) hidden trenches and fortifications and defence plans it has across the country are ultimately pointless because they'll just get bombed from above and into oblivion?

Iran's government is nuts and fundamentalist; they're not stupid or suicidal.

We know it. They know it.
 
Jormungandr said:
Iran won't do fuck all over its "red line". The moment they try anything, those US carriers and cruisers will bomb them to scrap -- especially their oil refineries.

They're not going to risk anything for the Palestinians, no matter what their version of an ITG from the UN says.
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And they can fuck with the traffic in the Straits of Hormuz and tell the houthis to resume shooting at Saudi oil refineries, and even without that happening losing Iranian supply will fuck over the world economy.

Dunno about you, but I have zero desire to see oil at over 200$ a barrel.
 
Agent23 said:
And they can fuck with the traffic in the Straits of Hormuz and tell the houthis to resume shooting at Saudi oil refineries, and even without that happening losing Iranian supply will fuck over the world economy.

Dunno about you, but I have zero desire to see oil at over 200$ a barrel.
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That's true, but Iran knows that it'd also fuck themselves over. Again, they're not suicidal or stupid.

Unless they want to go "let the world burn with us" over the Palestinians of all people, it's not gonna happen. Their "red line" is as useless as the average American Democrat.
 
Shipmaster Sane said:
It's complicated. Both of you are picking up on reality, this is largely a difference of Grammar.

A great deal of the modern world's politics are "justified" along racial lines, i.e. what benefits the non whites and often what harms the common white male. This doesn't help the non whites long term, collapsing the infrastructure that supports them while tossing them dollar bills like the Joker to watch them scrabble on the ground doesn't actually accomplish anything for them, and that's by design. Nearly a century of welfare and civil rights and specialized schooling and affirmative action have not actually improved the lot of most blacks, along many metrics the average black is worse off now than in 1950.
Someone who tries to prompt you to your worst impulses so as to harm his enemies or exploit your resources is not actually your friend, you're just his "valued" slave and he'll give you the stick if you don't take the carrot.


By effect, the west is strongly anti white, but while it has an extreme vested interest in increasing the number of nonwhites, it has no interest in increasing their prosperity, as they must be kept desperate and dependent and ready to point at enemies who "are the real reason you're poor".
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otherwise known as bioleninism.
 
GoldRanger said:
He walked back this statement after Palestinian pressure.
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Palestine itself will not accept a two state solution and wants nothing more than to drive the Jews into the sea.

They’ve made it into an existential conflict, and in the end one side will have to utterly finish the other to make it end. Why this Israelis don’t get that nastiness over with is mysterious to me. Don’t even need to do anything properly nasty, just crush the Palestinians, take their land, scatter them to the wind.

The ram touched the wall long ago.
 
Shipmaster Sane said:
A great deal of the modern world's politics are "justified" along racial lines, i.e. what benefits the non whites and often what harms the common white male. This doesn't help the non whites long term, collapsing the infrastructure that supports them while tossing them dollar bills like the Joker to watch them scrabble on the ground doesn't actually accomplish anything for them, and that's by design. Nearly a century of welfare and civil rights and specialized schooling and affirmative action have not actually improved the lot of most blacks, along many metrics the average black is worse off now than in 1950.
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The most important metric being single mothers.
went from 13% to between 77% (black-black) or 98% (black father non black mother)
which is just welfare working as it was designed to, to create a weapon for the aristocracy to wield against the "bourgeoise" (middle class).

imagine this
> Father, mother, 2 kids. both parents unemployeed
> single mother, 2 kids. mother unemployeed

the second scenario gets more money. despite having 1 less mouth to feed.
govt is literally offering cash incentives for the father to split.
 
Lord Sovereign said:
Palestine itself will not accept a two state solution and wants nothing more than to drive the Jews into the sea.

They’ve made it into an existential conflict, and in the end one side will have to utterly finish the other to make it end. Why this Israelis don’t get that nastiness over with is mysterious to me. Don’t even need to do anything properly nasty, just crush the Palestinians, take their land, scatter them to the wind.

The ram touched the wall long ago.
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Because it would mean war on all sides, and if you have been paying attention to what is going on in Ukraine, its a war Israel will not win w/o massive american assistance or nukes.
 
Marduk said:
They can do that... for a few weeks at most... If they *really* wish the US Navy to come and revoke their Navy having privileges... again.

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Last I heard they have been putting lots of money into short rented, decentralized drones, gunboats and missiles for just that situation.

And if you are going down, to quote the American expression "might as well go out swinging..."

But they are not suicidal, the big problem here is if Brandon pushes shit too hard.
 
AnimalNoodles said:
Because it would mean war on all sides, and if you have been paying attention to what is going on in Ukraine, it’s a war Israel will not win w/o massive american assistance or nukes.
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…for starters, who on Earth would be stupid enough to go to war over Palestine of all things, and for seconds I strongly doubt a bunch of Islamic militants with AK-47s are going to defeat the Israeli war machine.
 
Agent23 said:
Last I heard they have been putting lots of money into short rented, decentralized drones, gunboats and missiles for just that situation.
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Which is unlikely to work well. For one gunboats are going to work just as well as the last time Iran and Iraq thought they are a swell idea. Missiles will get them slapped around with airstrikes and Tomahawks, and drones, that's probably the biggest wildcard here.
Agent23 said:
And if you are going down, to quote the American expression "might as well go out swinging..."

But they are not suicidal, the big problem here is if Brandon pushes shit too hard.
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They have always a choice of not going out of the reservation and sticking to threats.
 
Lord Sovereign said:
…for starters, who on Earth would be stupid enough to go to war over Palestine of all things, and for seconds I strongly doubt a bunch of Islamic militants with AK-47s are going to defeat the Israeli war machine.
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The Arab nations around Israel sure aren't what they were in the 1940s-70s, there are two CBGs in the region specifically to make sure noone gets funny ideas, and they know that if they attack Israel again it just ends with them getting nuked.
 
Marduk said:
Which is unlikely to work well. For one gunboats are going to work just as well as the last time Iran and Iraq thought they are a swell idea. Missiles will get them slapped around with airstrikes and Tomahawks, and drones, that's probably the biggest wildcard here.
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Yeah, except that we have proof that cheap shit drone Zerg rushes are pretty effective due to the whole Ukraine war, and a lot of that development came about thanks to the Irs Ianians.
Marduk said:
They have always a choice of not going out of the reservation and sticking to threats.
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I would prefer no more disruptions to oil supplies or production decreases, thank you very much.

And a resumption of the talks between the USA, Saudi and Israel, preferably ones thdt less them to stopping the cuts.
 
Agent23 said:
Yeah, except that we have proof that cheap shit drone Zerg rushes are pretty effective due to the whole Ukraine war, and a lot of that development came about thanks to the Irs Ianians.
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Ground war vs naval war, apples and oranges. Most post cold war armies have really neglected low end air defense in favor of expensive missiles that can kill high performance jets, but that's a bad idea against thousands of drones, no one has that many missiles of this kind, and no one can afford to either.
That's the capability gap drones are really good at exploiting.

But almost every bloody warship comes with a gun based CIWS meant to intercept swarms of AShM's coming at 5-15 times the speed of a drone, guess what will it do to drones.
Not to mention some ships having power supply and antennas giving them EW capabilities beyond anything on land that isn't stationary.
Agent23 said:
I would prefer no more disruptions to oil supplies or production decreases, thank you very much.

And a resumption of the talks between the USA, Saudi and Israel, preferably ones thdt less them to stopping the cuts.
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Would you like a pony with that too?
 
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Lord Sovereign said:
…for starters, who on Earth would be stupid enough to go to war over Palestine of all things, and for seconds I strongly doubt a bunch of Islamic militants with AK-47s are going to defeat the Israeli war machine.
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Of course not,but they would die on tv.Maybe thanks to that USA stop supporting Ukraine.
Noble palestinian fighters are dying for Moscov,just like we/idiot poles/ died for Belgians,England or Prussia in Uprisings against Russia.
It seems,that History,as usual,teach notching.


Navarro said:
The Arab nations around Israel sure aren't what they were in the 1940s-70s, there are two CBGs in the region specifically to make sure noone gets funny ideas, and they know that if they attack Israel again it just ends with them getting nuked.
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No need for that,arab armies do not need nukes to be destroyed.And their owners are well aware of that fact.
 
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