United States Anti-Semitism in the United States (and elsewhere)

[CurtisLemay]

This is a personal reaction of a sort. I'm a mod, but I haven't really trusted myself to mod the Israel thread. Some of the folks posting there are just proving me right when I am convinced anti-semitism might be on the damn rise in this country.

My grandfather and his comrades did not spend 15 months in the ETO, culminating in the liberation of Odruf Nord (A subcamp of Dachau) just to see this become fashionable again. And I as his grandson am not going to put up with it either.

I am a American Jew. I love my country. I loved it enough to put up my right hand and write the proverbial check that included my life to my country. I found out I was an epileptic, which precluded my career plans in the Army, but I took the damn oath.

But I don't get to stop being a Jew. Not now, not ever. Because every time something like October 7th happens, there's always some idiot who's all too happy to remind me I am a Jew. Guess what? I am not afraid. I am a proud Jew of a long line of Jews who fought when their country needed them. I am proud of my damn lineage.

But now I hear Jews being afraid. Jews removing the mezuzahs over their doors. Worried about wearing their yarmalukes in public. Wondering if their synagogue is safe. Worried their kids are safe at school. And in every Jew's mind is one damn phrase "Dear G_d, not again."

We aren't Nazi Germany. We fought and beat Nazi Germany.

When I see idiots removing posters of missing children in Israel, I wonder if they have checked out on the human race. Really, if you agree with this? Are you a conservative? Do you stand for human freedom? What are your principles? Do you even have any? Or are you just a baying member of a bloodthirsty mob?

We see our supposed best and brightest at our elite universities join that baying mob. We see our media organs give them cover. Kudos to Fox News for not doing that. And we see a president whose party can't condemn it because they're scared of alienating their base. Um, excuse me? Part of your base are vile anti-semites. Who cares?

I know anti-semitism is against the rules here. And that is a good thing. But it's time to make a choice as members of this board between civilization and barbarism. Between light and darkness. It's time to take a stand. I'll stand alone if I have to. But I'd be grateful for the company.

 

[Zyobot]

Real sorry y'all are going through this. Seems not everyone got the memo, despite all the "Never again!" messaging over the last 80 years.

As you said yourself, we aren't another Nazi Germany. But there are quite a few places and factions outside the US that could easily become one, if Hamas (and its backers, of course) are any indication. Heck, Hitler's ghost probably has the whole damn Islamic World to pick from, as far as who's "most worthy" to finish what he started.

Maybe it needs another thread, but besides blinkered Leftists simping for Palestine, there are certain, uh... "religious communities" who have a pronounced streak of Anti-Semitism that they really need to tamp down on instead of sweeping it under the rug and crying about how oppressed they are. As is, they have a tendency to produce dangerous radicals more often than most religions, so while I can't blame every single Muslim for everything, the Islamic community at large has a serious radicalization problem — a problem only abetted by the media's reticence to identify who is responsible for all these attacks (even though it's plainly obvious to us, based on all the "Allahu Akbar!" chanting).

 

[ATP]

Yes,germans did horrible crimes,we all knew that.
But,arabs are semites,too.

 

[evilchumlee]

It's such a difficult situation all around.

Jewish people shouldn't have to deal with all the shit they deal with. Out of fucking anyone to be so dead set against, why Jews?! It never made sense to me. Like... Jews have historically and continue on today just generally have an attitude of "just leave us alone"?

Hamas and extremist muslims are an absolute parasite on this Earth.

At the same point... Israel doesn't do itself, and by extension, Jews across the world, alot of favors. It's hard to maintain sympathy for the Hamas attacks when Israel responds with... basically straight up warcrimes and a death toll in the thousands and growing.

To add to the mix, we have white supremacist in the US who are much less afraid of doing what they do over the past decade or so and actively spreading their bullshit through social media.

The extremists all around fuck everything over. The harder the SJW's on the left push, the more radical the radical right gets, which tends to attract the racists and all those assholes. Meanwhile the islamists are just waiting and watching those people melt down over each other to swoop in and Jihad.

Just... enough with the fucking extremism. The left sucks. The right sucks too. Their extremism on both sides is fueling all of this.

 

[Cherico]

It's such a difficult situation all around.

Jewish people shouldn't have to deal with all the shit they deal with. Out of fucking anyone to be so dead set against, why Jews?! It never made sense to me. Like... Jews have historically and continue on today just generally have an attitude of "just leave us alone"?

Hamas and extremist muslims are an absolute parasite on this Earth.

At the same point... Israel doesn't do itself, and by extension, Jews across the world, alot of favors. It's hard to maintain sympathy for the Hamas attacks when Israel responds with... basically straight up warcrimes and a death toll in the thousands and growing.

To add to the mix, we have white supremacist in the US who are much less afraid of doing what they do over the past decade or so and actively spreading their bullshit through social media.

The extremists all around fuck everything over. The harder the SJW's on the left push, the more radical the radical right gets, which tends to attract the racists and all those assholes. Meanwhile the islamists are just waiting and watching those people melt down over each other to swoop in and Jihad.

Just... enough with the fucking extremism. The left sucks. The right sucks too. Their extremism on both sides is fueling all of this.

We are a middle man minority, and pretty much every middle man minority deals with this kind of shit.

Ok heres how it works, a middle man minority goes out and provides connections between different groups of people. Lets say you have a farmer and a customer. Now in theory people think you can just cut out the middle man and have the farmer sell directly.

Yeah that shit doesn't work in real life because then the farmer has to take away from farming to sell goods. So a middle man goes in and gets the goods for the customer. Allowing the Farmer to specialize. Play this out with a whole bunch of professions. The presence of the middle man allows for more specialization which means the society as a whole becomes more profitable.

The problem is on the outside middlemen work looks easy, your just going from place to place collecting goods, and storing them and the middle men over the long term gain wealth doing this which creates resentment. Thing is, storage, arbatrage, inventory, and knowing what your doing as a middle man is a lot harder then it looks and if you fuck up you can lose everything, you also have to live pretty frugally because you never know when shit will hit the fan.

It gets worse though as you gain wealth, invitably people end up asking for a loan. Any one who got a semi decent job when their family isn't doing well can tell you fucking stories. Thing is while you might be willing to give a zero interest loan to a trusted friend you going to do that for a stranger?

Really? No, because you don't know them very well you charge interest because of the risk involved. Because if they fuck up your out of money. Now depending on trust levels and risk levels thats going to vary, and if some one is an asshole to you. Then its going to be real hard not to charge an asshole tax.

This helps the economy move better but it also creates more resentment, but it also compounds your wealth if your good at it get good enough and governments, and the high ups of society look for you for loans. Does this sound good?

No this isn't good this is a fucking bad thing this is a disaster because the government can just kill you steal your shit and then they don't have to pay back a single dime.

It can all be a vicious cycle of suck, honestly banks are a good thing because they insitutionalize loans instead of making them personal which reduces the amount of emotional heat of being in debt.

 

[ATP]

It's such a difficult situation all around.

Jewish people shouldn't have to deal with all the shit they deal with. Out of fucking anyone to be so dead set against, why Jews?! It never made sense to me. Like... Jews have historically and continue on today just generally have an attitude of "just leave us alone"?

Hamas and extremist muslims are an absolute parasite on this Earth.

At the same point... Israel doesn't do itself, and by extension, Jews across the world, alot of favors. It's hard to maintain sympathy for the Hamas attacks when Israel responds with... basically straight up warcrimes and a death toll in the thousands and growing.

To add to the mix, we have white supremacist in the US who are much less afraid of doing what they do over the past decade or so and actively spreading their bullshit through social media.

The extremists all around fuck everything over. The harder the SJW's on the left push, the more radical the radical right gets, which tends to attract the racists and all those assholes. Meanwhile the islamists are just waiting and watching those people melt down over each other to swoop in and Jihad.

Just... enough with the fucking extremism. The left sucks. The right sucks too. Their extremism on both sides is fueling all of this.

I have some good news - muslims are divided,too , once i feared fall of Europe and big powerpuff caliphate - now i knew,that it would be 10 smaller caliphates fighting each other which caliph is better.

@Cherico , i read book about ex-soviet states in Asia,and in one role of jews were taken by uzbeks,if i remember honestly.Before russian come there,they keep accumulating wealth till local nomads wiped them out.

And,in Indonesia,when chineese are doing jews job,they are target of pogroms.Formally in name of Allah,in reality it is all about moneys.

 

[Cherico]

I have some good news - muslims are divided,tonce i feared fall of Europe and big powerpuff caliphate - now i knew,that it would be 10 smaller caliphates fighting each other which caliph is better.

@Cherico , i read book about ex-soviet states in Asia,and in one role of jews were taken by uzbeks,if i remember honestly.Before russian come there,they keep accumulating wealth till local nomads wiped them out.

And,in Indonesia,when chineese are doing jews job,they are target of pogroms.Formally in name of Allah,in reality it is all about moneys.

yeah all examples of middle men minorities, and in islamic societies you actually need said minorities even more because the clan structures of the culture are really not good at social trust. Which is hilarious because Mohamid was a merchant and thus you would think that Islamic cultures would be great at finace and they used to be but not any more.

 

[ATP]

yeah all examples of middle men minorities, and in islamic societies you actually need said minorities even more because the clan structures of the culture are really not good at social trust. Which is hilarious because Mohamid was a merchant and thus you would think that Islamic cultures would be great at finace and they used to be but not any more.

Probably becouse Koran take society from 700AD or little later,and made it as sometching which could not be changed.
I read that Jews had the same problems with their laws,but avoided it by making other rules for those who do not lived in Palestine anymore.Which,till 1948,was practically all jews in the world.

 

[Cherico]

Probably becouse Koran take society from 700AD or little later,and made it as sometching which could not be changed.
I read that Jews had the same problems with their laws,but avoided it by making other rules for those who do not lived in Palestine anymore.Which,till 1948,was practically all jews in the world.

When your choice is flexibility or death you get flexible.

 

[shangrila]

The idea that wars have to kill roughly equal numbers of people on both sides or the side that kills more is "evil" is absurd leftist nonsense that that has killed vast numbers of people by freezing conflicts forever.

It's not Israel that doesn't do Jews a lot of favors, it's American leftist Jews, that are suddenly shocked that all the leftist groups they have funded and led over the last few decades aren't perfect tools and want to exterminate them too. Their surprise is amazing since I could swear there's an entire Jewish myth about this, something something golems.

The fact is that American Jews are the most privileged ethnic group in America, with vast nepotistic circles in numerous industries and institutions. Anti-Semitism is almost entirely powerless griping, except from the very leftist groups that Jews have long exercised power over and often empowered. Even today with Universities and such blatantly advocating Jew murder, I notice strong pushback that I don't recall ever seeing against the same groups discriminating against White or Asian males. I don't know what radicalized that ridiculous Hamas supporting Chinese American at Cornell, but I wouldn't be surprised that the immense difference that affirmative action and DIE in general treat Jews and Asian men played a part.

 

[SoliFortissimi]

Oh screw off. You lost in the last war, so just go crawl back under whatever rock you came from.

 

[Tiamat]

Oh screw off. You lost in the last war, so just go crawl back under whatever rock you came from.

Who are you addressing?

 

[SoliFortissimi]

Who are you addressing?

Shangri-la.

 

[Cherico]

The idea that wars have to kill roughly equal numbers of people on both sides or the side that kills more is "evil" is absurd leftist nonsense that that has killed vast numbers of people by freezing conflicts forever.

It's not Israel that doesn't do Jews a lot of favors, it's American leftist Jews, that are suddenly shocked that all the leftist groups they have funded and led over the last few decades aren't perfect tools and want to exterminate them too. Their surprise is amazing since I could swear there's an entire Jewish myth about this, something something golems.

The fact is that American Jews are the most privileged ethnic group in America, with vast nepotistic circles in numerous industries and institutions. Anti-Semitism is almost entirely powerless griping, except from the very leftist groups that Jews have long exercised power over and often empowered. Even today with Universities and such blatantly advocating Jew murder, I notice strong pushback that I don't recall ever seeing against the same groups discriminating against White or Asian males. I don't know what radicalized that ridiculous Hamas supporting Chinese American at Cornell, but I wouldn't be surprised that the immense difference that affirmative action and DIE in general treat Jews and Asian men played a part.

looks around at the shitty used RV he lives in.

"This is privilege?"

 

[Blasterbot]

looks around at the shitty used RV he lives in.

"This is privilege?"

it could always be worse I guess.

there is of course problems with generalization. that said hyper liberal voting wealthy jewish* people voting for policies that degrade the institutions is pretty common.

*may just be descended from jewish and aren't practicing

 

[DarthOne]

As tasteless as his option is, at least that Senator didn’t teach his pet pug to do the Nazi salute. That would be really offensive!



For those who don’t remember/get the joke, CountDankula (the Scottish guy who made the video) got into a surprising amount of trouble for teaching his wife’s pet pug to do the Nazi salute some years back.

As for why, his logic was ‘have something cute (pug) do something not-cute (Nazi salute) equals funny’.

It was pretty obviously a joke. Sadly, some people didn’t get it and he had to go to court over it. I believe he also got fined and had to do some minor jail time, but I might be mistaken.

 

[Abhorsen]

Yes,germans did horrible crimes,we all knew that.
But,arabs are semites,too.

This dumbass take needs to die. It's from people who don't understand language.

Language does not work by lego logic, where a word means the sum of its parts, and you can reliably cut up a word into sub parts to extract its meaning. Language works on large scale consensus. If enough people use a word to mean X for long enough that everyone understands what it means, that's what the word means. It's why "Yeah, right" usually means no way in hell, and "irregardless" and "regardless" have the same meaning, despite the 'ir-' prefix supposedly negating. It's why "literally" is usually used figuratively despite meaning the opposite.

Welcome to how language works.

So because antisemitism is used to convey Jew hatred, and is used and understood that way by nearly everyone, antisemitism means Jew Hatred. Even if there were no Jews who were Semetic, it would mean this. Language doesn't care about logic at all.

I'm happy to discuss with you and see points your making, but if you're just going to keep calling me antisemitic, there's no point.

Quite bluntly, you hold up a standard for Israel that no other country is held to. In fact, Israel is the country that does the most to not cause civilian casualties. It's far better than the US or any other country at war. It's advance warnings, etc, are all steps in their favor.

 

[King Arts]

This dumbass take needs to die. It's from people who don't understand language.

Language does not work by lego logic, where a word means the sum of its parts, and you can reliably cut up a word into sub parts to extract its meaning. Language works on large scale consensus. If enough people use a word to mean X for long enough that everyone understands what it means, that's what the word means. It's why "Yeah, right" usually means no way in hell, and "irregardless" and "regardless" have the same meaning, despite the 'ir-' prefix supposedly negating. It's why "literally" is usually used figuratively despite meaning the opposite.

Welcome to how language works.

So because antisemitism is used to convey Jew hatred, and is used and understood that way by nearly everyone, antisemitism means Jew Hatred. Even if there were no Jews who were Semetic, it would mean this. Language doesn't care about logic at all.

I'm sorry but this is nonsense. You are basically allowing one side to manipulate language and protect itself under the shield of "Anti Semitism" and use it as a cudgel against the other side. When the other side are actual semites.

 

[King Arts]

Problem with this take is that NO ONE I have ever heard speak of the Arab nations calls them Semites. It's simply not a part of their public identity.

Umm what? Other people may be ignorant but even the Arabs before they were Muslims when they were pagans knew themselves as sons of Ishmael.

 

[King Arts]

... Do you know what language is? Like at all? Language only works because we agree what things mean. That's its entire purpose: so that when I say a ball is purple, you know what that means. That works, because we both agree on what purple means. Hence, purple is only purple because we all agree to call it that. That's how literally how language works, and this applies to every word.

But there is obviously no consenses on what it is if there is people(not just me) saying that arabs are semites too. That Jews aren't the only semites. Even if it used to be used to refer to only jew hatered, that doesen't mean anything if the language evolves. If I told you I was gay you would think that I like men romantically. If I then get mad at you and say "I mean I am happy!" that would be very silly of me.

This isn't an attempt to change the meaning of a word, either. antisemitism has long meant jew hatred. You are in fact the one trying to change the meaning of a word, one with a long and widely accepted definition.

Anti semitism came from Germans they wanted a word so they could dress up their bigotry against Jews and make it sound scientifically "Oh no I don't hate the Jews because they refuse to convert to Christinity. I dislike them because they are a foreign ethnic group not indigenous to Europe. They are from the middle east, I am against having middle easterners in Europe." Before this Jew hate was because of mostly religious dislike, after that it was "scientific" they claimed that semetic people had certain biological traits that put them at odds with Europeans.