chimp vs human males...classic internet topic happening right now on sherdog

[colorles]

Bo nickle says he could knock out a chimp

so a ufc fighter claimed he could knock out a chimp in a fight. feel free to read the thread but i figured i'd make my own thread here to get some of your takes on this subject.

i've made quite a few posts already in that thread, but here's my first post:

few points here:

1) a chimp is going to have a different mental approach to a fight than anyone Bo Nickal has fought. it is fighting for it's life, to maim and kill. i would advise bo nickal to not make eye contact with the animal and just approach the fight mechanically; i know guys throw around the word "killer" here alot when talking about sport fighters, but it would be unsettling for a sport fighter to look into the eyes of an actual psychopath killer. and that is what the chimp is, a psychopathic animal.

2) even if chimps are not that big by human male standards, they have bio mechanical advantages. their arms and the tendons and attachments in their arms are way longer than humans, granting more leverage. they also have very large hands with very long fingers at the end of these long arms. and a lot of fast twitch muscle to provide force to these levers, and the mental "retard strength" to boot. they also have a long torso for their size, meaning a strong back to aid in grappling. and their feet are like other grappling limbs as well.

While i'd be more interested in seeing Rousimar Palhares vs a chimp, if Bo Nicakl wants to have a go at it, i'm sure it would get millions of views on social media and would make some real money and clout to go with it. a no rules organization like King of the Streets would probably be willing to organize it.

Fight Application - King Of The Streets

put the application in Bo Nickals, would probably make you famous as fuck and in the modern world, being internet famous equates to a lot of money

Figured that humans vs animal topics are always intesting. so what do you all think?

 

[UberIguana]

For a start, knocking out a chimp is hard. They're build to have passable resistance to injury from falling out of trees. A chimp would also fight in a very different way to the styles he's used to. He should expect to get bitten a lot and chimps have some pretty serious teeth.

His best chance would probably be to grab it by the throat and and keep hold of it. The main problem with this is it's going to be swinging around in and possibly over his hand so it might end up twisting loose. At this point it'll have control of his now free arm. He might not be able to regain control the same way once it's done trying to bite his fingers off.

This assumes they can get it to fight and it doesn't keep trying to run away.

 

[bintananth]

If the chimp isn't muzzled with its hands in boxing gloves Bo Nickal will be maimed or killed.

Google "chimpanzee attack" if you don't believe me.

 

[Jormungandr]

Chimps are vicious motherfuckers and, IIRC, are far more muscular than the average human. There's a lot of strength in that compact frame.

Maybe if they were the strongest man in the world or someone who was at Arnold Schwarzenegger's level of strength during his bodybuilding height/peak, they'd have a chance of physically outpunching a chimp (not counting the mutilations those fuckers like to inflict, e.g. face, groin, et cetera).

But outside of that? Nope.

 

[ThatZenoGuy]

Chimps are vicious motherfuckers and, IIRC, are far more muscular than the average human. There's a lot of strength in that compact frame.

Maybe if they were the strongest man in the world or someone who was at Arnold Schwarzenegger's level of strength during his bodybuilding height/peak, they'd have a chance of physically outpunching a chimp (not counting the mutilations those fuckers like to inflict, e.g. face, groin, et cetera).

But outside of that? Nope.

Chimps aren't actually that strong. Proportionally they're about twice as strong as a human, which isn't too unusual as smaller things in general are stronger (reminder an ant is like 20000 times stronger than a human...Proportionally).

Buuuuuuuuut a chimp is also like half the size of a person, with a mass of around 40-60kg weight.
In a straight-up fight, a beefy trained fighter should be able to demolish a chimp by sheer mass, strength and training.

Bring in a world-class strongman like the Mountain's actor and he'd crush the chimp.

 

[colorles]

Chimps aren't actually that strong. Proportionally they're about twice as strong as a human, which isn't too unusual as smaller things in general are stronger (reminder an ant is like 20000 times stronger than a human...Proportionally).

Buuuuuuuuut a chimp is also like half the size of a person, with a mass of around 40-60kg weight.
In a straight-up fight, a beefy trained fighter should be able to demolish a chimp by sheer mass, strength and training.

Bring in a world-class strongman like the Mountain's actor and he'd crush the chimp.

yeah a good size man with grappling experience could potentially throw it around a little bit. but there lies the problem: once the chimp gets a hold of said man, it's combination of inhumanly long / strong arms and hands - and they are inhumanly strong, they are just build differently with longer tendons / insertion points - would allow it to keep a strong grip on the man and rip flesh, rip apart joints and just straight up bite the man.

not a pleasant ordeal to have one of those things latched to you. and no, the mountain hathor bjornson is not "crushing" a chimp just based on sheer size. he could potentially kill it; but he is not escaping that fight without some serious damage at the very least. and that is assuming he has the mentality needed to effectively fight such a blood thirsty and psychopathic animal.

 

[JasonSanjo]

Yeah, like Zeno pointed out the strength of a chimp is often exaggerated to Nth degree by people who... know absolutely nothing about chimps, biology or physics. Proportionately they are indeed stronger than humans, however most of the misconception of their strength comes from the fact that chimps have significantly less fine motor control than humans do.

Basically, chimps simply aren't able to use as low a percentage of their total strength as humans are. This has led many humans, mistakenly thinking that chimps use the same strength percentage for small tasks as a human would, to believe that chimps are much, much stronger than humans due to using a greater total strength for small tasks. However this apparent disparity isn't actually the result of greater strength but the result of a limitation of their biology compared to humans (This is considered one of the primary reasons chimps aren't as effective tool users as humans, by the way).

So yes, take a human of equal size and mass to a chimp, and the chimp will be a good deal stronger. Take a human with twice the overall size and (muscle) mass as the chimp, however, and that no longer remains true.

The big problem for a UFC fighter isn't going to be a difference in strength or even overall grappling ability - it's going to be that the chimp doesn't fight by UFC rules. Fighting a chimp is going to be a lot more like a street fight than a ring fight, complete with eye gouging, biting fingers, going for the throat/back of the head, biting the groin, ripping off tendons, etc. If the UFC fighter approaches a fight with a chimp like he would a ring fight, odds are he's going to get himself killed unless he manages to disorient the chimp with a few good hits to the head early on. If he is experienced with and approaches it more like a street fight, though? That's a whole other story.

Even then, however, chimps are tough, and not just for their size. Yes, they have the same overall structural weaknesses as humans do, but they have plenty of thick fur to cushion blows, they are used to grappling and rolling with impacts (assuming an adult male chimp, here), and they have thick skulls. A well-trained, unarmed human can beat a chimp in a fight - but only if he actually treats it like a real fight as opposed to like a match. There will be no referee, no rules, and probably no ring. If the UFC fighter makes the same assumptions as he would for a regular UFC match, he's going to get demolished in short order unless he gets lucky.

Of course, all that assumes the chimp actually wants to fight to the death/unconsciousness as opposed to getting a few good bites in and then running away... Which could go either way, really, given normal chimp behavior.

 

[colorles]

Yeah, like Zeno pointed out the strength of a chimp is often exaggerated to Nth degree by people who... know absolutely nothing about chimps, biology or physics. Proportionately they are indeed stronger than humans, however most of the misconception of their strength comes from the fact that chimps have significantly less fine motor control than humans do.

Basically, chimps simply aren't able to use as low a percentage of their total strength as humans are. This has led many humans, mistakenly thinking that chimps use the same strength percentage for small tasks as a human would, to believe that chimps are much, much stronger than humans due to using a greater total strength for small tasks. However this apparent disparity isn't actually the result of greater strength but the result of a limitation of their biology compared to humans (This is considered one of the primary reasons chimps aren't as effective tool users as humans, by the way).

So yes, take a human of equal size and mass to a chimp, and the chimp will be a good deal stronger. Take a human with twice the overall size and (muscle) mass as the chimp, however, and that no longer remains true.

The big problem for a UFC fighter isn't going to be a difference in strength or even overall grappling ability - it's going to be that the chimp doesn't fight by UFC rules. Fighting a chimp is going to be a lot more like a street fight than a ring fight, complete with eye gouging, biting fingers, going for the throat/back of the head, biting the groin, ripping off tendons, etc. If the UFC fighter approaches a fight with a chimp like he would a ring fight, odds are he's going to get himself killed unless he manages to disorient the chimp with a few good hits to the head early on. If he is experienced with and approaches it more like a street fight, though? That's a whole other story.

Even then, however, chimps are tough, and not just for their size. Yes, they have the same overall structural weaknesses as humans do, but they have plenty of thick fur to cushion blows, they are used to grappling and rolling with impacts (assuming an adult male chimp, here), and they have thick skulls. A well-trained, unarmed human can beat a chimp in a fight - but only if he actually treats it like a real fight as opposed to like a match. There will be no referee, no rules, and probably no ring. If the UFC fighter makes the same assumptions as he would for a regular UFC match, he's going to get demolished in short order unless he gets lucky.

Of course, all that assumes the chimp actually wants to fight to the death/unconsciousness as opposed to getting a few good bites in and then running away... Which could go either way, really, given normal chimp behavior.

the chimp should be getting more respect than this. it doesn't matter if it is a lot lighter than a large man. it has the bio mechanical advantages in the right places to, should it get a hold of said man, keep its hold of said man and inflict serious damage.


and yes their hands are significantly stronger than even the hands of very strong men. just the bio mechanics of their hands, show that.

don't be fooled by all the muscle that human athletes and weight lifters can put on. muscle is not the same thing as bone structure, tendons and tendon insertions. the arms and hands of chimps are far superior levers in that regard

i am not even getting into the mental issues most humans, even trained ones, would have fighting a bloodthirsty animal.

 

[JasonSanjo]

the chimp should be getting more respect than this. it doesn't matter if it is a lot lighter than a large man. it has the bio mechanical advantages in the right places to, should it get a hold of said man, keep its hold of said man and inflict serious damage.


and yes their hands are significantly stronger than even the hands of very strong men. just the bio mechanics of their hands, show that.

-images snipped-

don't be fooled by all the muscle that human athletes and weight lifters can put on. muscle is not the same thing as bone structure, tendons and tendon insertions. the arms and hands of chimps are far superior levers in that regard

i am not even getting into the mental issues most humans, even trained ones, would have fighting a bloodthirsty animal.

I... beg your pardon? Objective biometrics are objective biometrics - respect does not factor into it in the slightest. The first three paragraphs of my post simply addressed a very common misconception and corrected it, nothing more.

And yes, chimps have long arms and strong hands, giving them an advantage in grappling - which is acknowledged in my post.

And yes, the mental issues are a major factor even for trained fighters - in this case the biggest, in fact. Which is why I spent a paragraph and a half directly addressing them.

And I'm not sure who's getting fooled by muscle, here? Apart from the part of my post addressing a common misconception and righting it with objective biometric facts, I didn't even bring up muscle. Are you getting my post mixed up with someone else's?

I mean no disrespect here, but I get the distinct feeling that you only skimmed my post without actually processing its contents fully. Well, either that or there's a rather sizable language barrier issue; I don't know you, and I've never been a good mind reader, so I can't tell which.

 

[colorles]

I... beg your pardon? Objective biometrics are objective biometrics - respect does not factor into it in the slightest. The first three paragraphs of my post simply addressed a very common misconception and corrected it, nothing more.

And yes, chimps have long arms and strong hands, giving them an advantage in grappling - which is acknowledged in my post.

And yes, the mental issues are a major factor even for trained fighters - in this case the biggest, in fact. Which is why I spent a paragraph and a half directly addressing them.

And I'm not sure who's getting fooled by muscle, here? Apart from the part of my post addressing a common misconception and righting it with objective biometric facts, I didn't even bring up muscle. Are you getting my post mixed up with someone else's?

I mean no disrespect here, but I get the distinct feeling that you only skimmed my post without actually processing its contents fully. Well, either that or there's a rather sizable language barrier issue; I don't know you, and I've never been a good mind reader, so I can't tell which.

I did skim through your post and was also debating this subject with a bunch of meatheads on another site, hence the edge to my post.

In any case, here are a couple of guys that are knowingly consenting to a no-rules fight on concrete...and yet still notice the reaction of the man getting his eyes gouged



How is a man - trained, or not - going to react when a chimp gets a hold of him and does far worse?

 

[JasonSanjo]

I did skim through your post and was also debating this subject with a bunch of meatheads on another site, hence the edge to my post.

In any case, here are a couple of guys that are knowingly consenting to a no-rules fight on concrete...and yet still notice the reaction of the man getting his eyes gouged



How is a man - trained, or not - going to react when a chimp gets a hold of him and does far worse?

As before, that doesn't contradict anything I said in my original post, so... Yeah. No comment.

 

[bintananth]

i am not even getting into the mental issues most humans, even trained ones, would have fighting a bloodthirsty animal.

I'll go there: willing one-on-one fisticuffs with a wild animal large enough to be a physical threat goes against the primal survival instincts we've got. "Up close and personal" is the exact opposite of what we evolved to do: "Use ranged weapons from a safe distance."

 

[ParadiseLost]

I think the one thing easy to agree on is that Bo Nickle would be a fool to try.