I guess then the questions are?
1. Have we crossed the rubicon?
2. Can we step back from this?
3. Where and how does this end?
1. Have we crossed the rubicon?
2. Can we step back from this?
3. Where and how does this end?
Validity of Left-Right Divide Concerns
- Thread starter CurtisLemay
- Start date
Xilizhra
Well-known member
1. No.
2. Yes.
3. That depends entirely on who is willing to concede that the other side isn't a bunch of faceless monsters and is, in fact, possessed of valid concerns even if one doesn't like how they're being addressed.
Xilizhra
Well-known member
Ultimately, political and religious dogmas serve more or less the same purpose: the building and reinforcement of community. To treat politics like religion is no new thing, and indeed, political leaders of all stripes dream of harnessing it.
Unwise political leaders of all stripes dream of harnessing it.
We seperated church and state for a reason, because this kind of thing? Its like riding a very hungry tiger.
Or become god-king.Pharaohs did it,so why somebody not try that again ?
LordsFire
Internet Wizard
It has never (in America) been the position of the right that the left are faceless monsters. Sure, there are fringe elements who argue that, but it's never entered the platform of the political right in any phase of our history that I'm aware of.
The dehumanization, hysteria, and mass violence are entirely the realm of the left. (Yes, there have been fringe right standout actors responsible for some horrible things, but they're always either rejected, denounced, or both by the right in general and the leaders of right in particular.)
Just like in the 70's, the source of all this violence is the left throwing a temper tantrum because they don't have their hands on all the power.
Xilizhra
Well-known member
My point exactly. The question is, do you want to deescalate things, or do you want to just win?
Floridaman
Well-known member
Deescelation through appeasement is not an option at all, because at some point they decide they want it all.
Xilizhra
Well-known member
All right, let's start with this. Can you say "I believe that leftists have valid concerns, even if I disapprove of how they address them?" I can say and have said it for rightists.
Dennis Prager has a pretty common saying in regards to a main difference between the Left and Right.
"The Right thinks the Left is Wrong. The Left thinks the Right is Evil."
Obviously a generalization especially with fringe elements on the Right reacting to increasingly Far Left shifting but still a core of truth I feel.
Floridaman
Well-known member
Sure, certain problems do exist. The problem is their solutions tend to produce even bigger problems.
Xilizhra
Well-known member
That's something. So, what concessions do you want, and what concessions are you willing to offer?
Floridaman
Well-known member
My preferred option is a return to true federalism. You do whatever you want in your states, and leave everyone else alone. If California wants to be communist, fine but they can't touch people from other states and vice versa.
Xilizhra
Well-known member
Taste varies, clearly. The black-blonde-haired woman especially, I find cute.
All right. So, how will you handle things like federal aid? Enforcement of federal law? How much in the way of federal law would have to be repealed? Because there are some very pertinent questions that'll have to be answered...
Floridaman
Well-known member
The federal government would return to simply being the foreign face, there would be no federal enforcement as there would be no federal law. The only areas where it would have a say are trade with foreign powers, and war. In effect the states would be free to act as they wish. All resources along state lines would be divided equally, with states being able to trade for resources.
Think EU
Knowledgeispower
Ah I love the smell of missile spam in the morning
Hmmmm you must have a majorly different understanding of the Federalist Papers and Constitution than I do then.
Xilizhra
Well-known member
Or the Articles of Confederation? Well... actually, this should probably be a different thread.
Floridaman
Well-known member
The federalist proposal that a centralized Federal government could protect rights has become naught but a joke as factions struggle to tell the rest of the people how they must live.
Edit: and in reply to the articles of confederation concern, the fundamental problem was the federal government was unable to get money as it had no direct power of taxation, that isn't an issue anymore since the income tax is a thing.
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Terthna
Professional Lurker
Speaking as a leftist myself, I of course believe my own concerns are valid; but not every leftist has the same concerns, and there are many I would consider not valid. Like concerns over Systemic Racism; because while racism does exist on an individual level, and probably always will, the only systemic examples of it I can see all comes from the left. In essence, in trying to fix an issue that did not exist, they created and perpetuate that very issue.
Left and leftist always had valid concerns - But:
1.They belive in possibility of building Earthy Paradise - which means revolution,genocide,hell on earth - and finally new oligarhy ruling.Which do not care about any concerns other then their power.
2.Current leftist are funded and used by oligarchs like Soros who do not care about anything other then their power.Which means,that talking to leftist has no sense,we should just talk to Soros.
All in all - they are puppets who have no power,and even if they have real power,they would use it to create hell on Earth.