Skallagrim
Well-known member
That's grasping at straws. That whole previous episode set up that the attachment that Din felt towards Grogu (and vice versa) was the problem Luke and Ahsoka were worried about and warning against. Trying to justify that by pretending that it was about age and life-span issues is complete nonsense. It's a given that if Grogu lives a long life that isn't cut short, he'll outlive all other characters... including Luke, too.Except that's not what Luke said. He told Grogu that if he stayed to train, he might not see the Mandalorian again because of the difference in their lifespans. That's literally true -- since Grogu is visibly still a toddler at 50 years old, he might not reach a mature Padawan equivalent level for a century or more.
Your whole argument implicitly recognises that Luke's ultimatum boils down to "you don't see him again until I'm done training you", which -- again -- is a psychopath's manipulative ultimatum by definition. Known jack-ass and attempted nephew-murderer Jake Skywalker would do that kind of thing, but the Luke Skywalker we recognise wouldn't. Because, as the original films starring him actually demonstrated, he knows that love and connection to others is the greatest strength we have.
RotJ literally ends with him fixing the fatal flaw of the old order.
This bullshit has him repeating that flaw... but worse. So he is indeed descending into Jake Skywalker territory. Becoming the pathetic imitation of himself we see in TLJ.
One major problem with that reasoning is that they actively sought out the Force-sensitive kids. And that it's also established that if Force abilities aren't honed by training, they barely ever manifest, or even fade away as you grow older.In defense of the Jedi on the "forcefully recruiting kids" front.
Imagine a force sensitive teenager, full of uncontrolled hormones and emotions, without ANY Jedi training? Pretty much walking Darkside fodder and while probably not as powerful as a properly trained Sith or Jedi, we're still talking capable of a LOT of nasty things. I mean the Mind Trick ALONE would allow all sorts of very nasty mischief and it's demonstratably one of the easier powers to learn and manifest. And considering that the Dark Side is consistently portrayed as "easier" to learn than proper Force use, it would make sense that a sufficiently powerful force sensitive without training would more likely end up following the Dark Path and thus and end up causing considerable damage to their community and themselves.
As such, while I do disagree with the cutting off of attachments practiced by the Jedi, the situation Force sensitives are in is not entirely dissimilar to that of Mages in Dragon Age. They are demonstratable dangerous to their communities if left untrained, and so mandatory training away from those communities at young ages is a valid societal response...
"We have to train you in isolation because of the powers that might be dangerous... but only if we train you" is insane troll logic.
I understand that the Jedi want new recruits, and I don't blame them. I also understand that they have to start the training at a young age if they start it all, because you'll typically have trouble learning the prerequisite restraint unless you learn that from a young age. But the idea that the galaxy would be over-run by unchecked Force-users if the Jedi didn't do what they did is nonsense. The real outcome is simply that the Jedi would die out, and Force-users would become vanishingly rare.
(Okay, in reality, the Banite Sith would emerge from the shadows and take over, but nobody knew that, so that can't count as a justification.)
Anyway, as I've reasoned above, Luke in the OT already demonstrated that the old Jedi had been wrong about all of this, and that his "attachments" (if properly managed) actually mde him much stronger -- and a better Jedi. So what the Jedi should have been doing instead of isolating your inductees from their old lives would be the opposite of that. The Jedi should have moved out of their ivory tower-- uh, temple, and should have started living among the people. New inductees should be raised in their own communities, with Jedi moving into the community to essentially tutor them in a natural setting. That approach would teach the younglings to manage their attachments to others, rather than suppress those attachments.
In the old EU, this is what Jedi had actually more-or-less done for over 90% of their history, and what the Corellian Jedi had kept on doing all along (and kriff the council's dictates). And it worked just fine.
We shouldn't ever forget that the Jedi Order before the Clone Wars had been manipulated by Sith plotting, actively steered towards stagnation, isolation, and other deeply unhealthy patterns. They weren't right. They were the misguided victims of a cruel conspiracy, blinded by the shroud of the Dark Side that the Banite Sith cast over the galaxy during their thousand-year "march through the insitutions".
The truest Jedi we ever saw on screen was Luke Skywalker, facing Palpatine. And what does Palpatine tell him? That his love for his friends is a weakness that will doom him. And Luke proves him dead wrong. Love saves everything.
Last edited: