Taiwan Torpedos Deal

Probably, yes Japan doesnt want China to be able to reach the open ocean, and if the US is involved Japn joins automatically

It says something about Japan when they're in with a shout of defeating China at sea in pitched battle. When the People's Republic of China inevitably collapses (because Communism), Japan is exceedingly well placed to exert tremendous influence in a post-Beijing Asia.
 
You know I wonder if Taiwan ever considered getting submarines from Japan since they're not likely to care about what China thinks, of course they decided to go their own path due to politics
 
You know I wonder if Taiwan ever considered getting submarines from Japan since they're not likely to care about what China thinks, of course they decided to go their own path due to politics
First problem:
Until 2014 this was outright impossible.
Second problem:
How many countries can afford Japan's submarines and is Taiwan one of them?
 
It says something about Japan when they're in with a shout of defeating China at sea in pitched battle. When the People's Republic of China inevitably collapses (because Communism), Japan is exceedingly well placed to exert tremendous influence in a post-Beijing Asia.
South Korea would be on thier list as well, hosting the largest US Ground troop presence in the pacific outside of US territories.
Taiwan being attacked would cause major issues, involving mobilization of US troops in Japan, Guam, and South Korea.
I would assess that they would coordinate that with a strong North Korean threat to prevent mobilization of the assets in South Korea.
 
South Korea would be on thier list as well, hosting the largest US Ground troop presence in the pacific outside of US territories.
Taiwan being attacked would cause major issues, involving mobilization of US troops in Japan, Guam, and South Korea.
I would assess that they would coordinate that with a strong North Korean threat to prevent mobilization of the assets in South Korea.

Speaking of which, the South Korean fleet is nothing to sneeze at either. As I understand it, along with plenty of modern destroyers, frigates, corvettes and submarines, the South Koreans rather like their gunnery drill as well.

China is surrounded by stronger neighbors than it would like to admit.
 
Speaking of which, the South Korean fleet is nothing to sneeze at either. As I understand it, along with plenty of modern destroyers, frigates, corvettes and submarines, the South Koreans rather like their gunnery drill as well.

China is surrounded by stronger neighbors than it would like to admit.
Basically Taiwan will be the spot for the rest of east Asia to go fuck you China! With America going "Yes little ones Yes! We are here for you!:
 
Basically Taiwan will be the spot for the rest of east Asia to go fuck you China! With America going "Yes little ones Yes! We are here for you!:

People might disagree, but I do ponder whether or not Taiwan, South Korea, and Japan could actually beat back China on their own. Regardless, it's a fight Beijing probably doesn't want.

But if the situation did blow up, what's the reckoning Vietnam leaps at the chance to put a knife in China's back?
 
People might disagree, but I do ponder whether or not Taiwan, South Korea, and Japan could actually beat back China on their own. Regardless, it's a fight Beijing probably doesn't want.

But if the situation did blow up, what's the reckoning Vietnam leaps at the chance to put a knife in China's back?
Basically if you make a Venn diagram of "Countries that border China" and "Countries that hate China" you only need to draw one circle.
 
Perhaps with the sole exception of Russia who likes their cash.
More like North Korea. Russia is only putting a poker face on to trade with China because it needs the money, and also has a shared interest in weakening US global influence. In long term though the ascendancy of China is a mortal threat to Russia and Putin knows it. China *really* could use the vast, sparsely populated, underdeveloped yet resource rich lands of eastern Russia. If it came to open conflict, short of making it go nuclear, there is no way Russia could defend most of that.
 
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More like North Korea. Russia is only putting a poker face on to trade with China because it needs the money, and also has a shared interest in weakening US global influence. In long term though the ascendancy of China is a mortal threat to Russia and Putin knows it. China *really* could use the vast, sparsely populated, underdeveloped yet resource rich lands of eastern Russia. If it came to open conflict, short of making it go nuclear, there is no way Russia could defend most of that.
And China knows the much of the US would happily let Russia stomp China into the stone age.

Particularly after this virus bullshit.
 
South Korea would be on thier list as well, hosting the largest US Ground troop presence in the pacific outside of US territories.
Taiwan being attacked would cause major issues, involving mobilization of US troops in Japan, Guam, and South Korea.
I would assess that they would coordinate that with a strong North Korean threat to prevent mobilization of the assets in South Korea.

Yeah I was wondering what would happen in regards to US Troops in South Korea in the case of some sort of conventional conflict between China and the United States whether over Taiwan or the South China Sea or something. Because if South Korea is dragged into a conflict, then it almost seems de facto that North Korea would invest itself as well and that would widen the war dramatically (for South Korea specifically) since dealing with North Korea would naturally take up most of their resources and focus as well as that of US troops in Korea.

Maybe if there is some sort of "limited" conflict in regards to Taiwan the US Forces or South Korea might not want to get involved and instead US forces in Korea would "stay out of it" inasmuch as they won't fly anti-Chinese combat missions using South Korea airspace and territorial waters or some US forces would redeploy out of South Korea to Japan or Taiwan or wherever so that the war wouldn't spread to the Korean peninsula.
 
In long term though the ascendancy of China is a mortal threat to Russia and Putin knows it. China *really* could use the vast, sparsely populated, underdeveloped yet resource rich lands of eastern Russia. If it came to open conflict, short of making it go nuclear, there is no way Russia could defend most of that.

The old bear may be wounded, but it is far from dead. China would do well to let it sleep, else the Red Dragon may find its head in a scarred, mighty paw.

I have little doubt the Chinese would make good progress initially, until the sheer vastness of Russia hits home. Then there is the, as I understand it, recently professionalised Russian Army that will shed its blood for every inch of the "Sacred Motherland." Russians do not make peace with invaders until they are ejected or outright destroyed, and they do not lose wars on their soil. History has proven the Russian fighting man can suffer unbearable hardships in the defence of his country, hardships which I doubt a culturally damaged automaton of a Chinese conscript will put up with. Then there is all the old Cold War equipment they are upgrading for functional use, giving Russia access to a veritable armada of armour. This is one of the most heavily mechanised armies in the world, after all.

Above all, Chinese troops in Russia would force the country to unite around Putin, demanding he continue to prosecute the war until the perfidious invader is ejected to which he will happily comply and massively expand the Russian military. Meanwhile, the Chinese Communist Party continues to lose face as their army is bled dry whilst the voices of dissent grow louder. It would be rerun of the Great Patriotic War without the ideological zealotry.

The Russian Bear can only ever be contained. It cannot be overthrown in its own lair.
 
The old bear may be wounded, but it is far from dead. China would do well to let it sleep, else the Red Dragon may find its head in a scarred, mighty paw.

I have little doubt the Chinese would make good progress initially, until the sheer vastness of Russia hits home. Then there is the, as I understand it, recently professionalised Russian Army that will shed its blood for every inch of the "Sacred Motherland." Russians do not make peace with invaders until they are ejected or outright destroyed, and they do not lose wars on their soil. History has proven the Russian fighting man can suffer unbearable hardships in the defence of his country, hardships which I doubt a culturally damaged automaton of a Chinese conscript will put up with. Then there is all the old Cold War equipment they are upgrading for functional use, giving Russia access to a veritable armada of armour. This is one of the most heavily mechanised armies in the world, after all.

Above all, Chinese troops in Russia would force the country to unite around Putin, demanding he continue to prosecute the war until the perfidious invader is ejected to which he will happily comply and massively expand the Russian military. Meanwhile, the Chinese Communist Party continues to lose face as their army is bled dry whilst the voices of dissent grow louder. It would be rerun of the Great Patriotic War without the ideological zealotry.

The Russian Bear can only ever be contained. It cannot be overthrown in its own lair.
Do not confuse Russian West for Russian East. It would be a very different war than what happened in Europe. Ultimately, Russia naturally had the advantage of being a bigger, more populous country against all its historical invaders, and once it got its shit in order, could crush them in superior numbers of soldiers and tanks, while these wars happened relatively close to its population and logistical centers.

But the war in Far East would be quite different. Its a ridiculous amount of land, about one and half USA, populated by probably less than 6 million people as of now, with barely few strategic logistical routes crossing it. Airpower, maneuver warfare and combat engineering would rule. No need to get bogged down in Stalingrad like urban warfare, or worry about populated countryside creating a guerilla threat, just go around cities, China doesn't need their people, it has its own, it needs the resources around them.
Meanwhile, the 3 provinces of China neighboring the Far East have a population in low 3 digit millions, and proportionally good logistical access to the region.

Of course China also has no shortage of heavy equipment and keeps churning out more, while Russia is waning in that department - compare the numbers of their newest gear they are rolling out to the modernized ex-soviet stuff that is bound to become too outdated or old eventually. Time is playing in China's favor in this regard massively, which is one of main reasons why they aren't making moves yet.
Simply put, China is a country whose military is still being built up to its economic capabilities, while Russia, the opposite - due to still benefiting from fruits of Soviet Union's ridiculous military spending it is better off than it can afford on its own economy in long term.


This war is a closer comparison, as it does involve Russia defending Far East.
 
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First problem:
Until 2014 this was outright impossible.
Second problem:
How many countries can afford Japan's submarines and is Taiwan one of them?

Australia was close to buying the Soryu Jap subs (in fact the Japanese arms trading law was likely ammended for that purpose) but for some reason we went with the French ones...

I'd prefer we just bought some Virginia Class ones which were offered from the USA and built a nuclear re-fueling facility in Australia but our politicians are too spineless to go nuclear.
 
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Australia was close to buying the Soryu Jap subs (in fact the Japanese arms trading law was likely ammended for that purpose) but for some reason we went with the French ones...

I'd prefer we just bought some Virginia Class ones which were offered from the USA and built a nuclear re-fueling facility in Australia but our politicians are too spineless to go nuclear.

Yeah it still baffles me why Australia purchased "pump-jet" submarines that can only stay underwater for 20 minutes! I mean like honestly, I know the Collins-class had a rough development but don't be in duch a rush to replace it with such an inferior design even if it is newer.
 

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