Crystonian
New member
I have to say this has been one of the more interesting stories. I dont know if this already been discussed but I'm interested in see what the USA in this timeline does with China.
Fallout The Eagle And The Bear [Fallout AU]
- Thread starter Navarro
- Start date
Navarro
Well-known member
Especially with all the shenanigans with Eden that Autumn knew about, even if he didn't expose the truth to others ... E-USA does not really trust robots or AI. Affluent families will have a robot servant, there are a few ZAXes still around, and robots are used as a supplement to the core of the army ... but mass robotic formations? Definitely a no-go.
ForeverShogo
Well-known member
Funny, because the AI from the Earth 21X0 games was completely loyal and genuinely acted in the best interests of the United Civilized States. To the extent that the AI not pulling a Skynet was actually a plot point in 2160.
Granted, said AI still de facto took over the UCS bloodlessly by being so much better at running the country than the politicians that no one really thought twice about letting them run things.
Granted, said AI still de facto took over the UCS bloodlessly by being so much better at running the country than the politicians that no one really thought twice about letting them run things.
Aaron Fox
Well-known member
Please note that in the Earth 21X0 series, the UCS designed their AI to run the country, first as advisors, who then became 'advisors', then became the actual leadership. It should be noted that the UCS AI in 2160's entire plan is 'sit behind an impenetrable shield, let the LC and ED weaken themselves with pointless wars, then -using the bases it setup- crush them with UCS industrial and technological might' but once it was told about Eden via the MCs, it basically went 'fuck this shit, I'm out'.
Also, the UCS 'government' isn't a government at all, just a giant ass lottery. You don't get elected; you see if your lotto ticket is drawn up.
It should be noted that Eden was an Emergent AI, fed just all the Enclave BS over the decades. Due to the lack of manpower and the numerous threats in the Wastelands, the E-USA will need to work on combat androids and whatnot. With what is essentially the poster boys for 'what not to do' for AIs being known, a project to create what is essentially UCS AIs should be in the works to help shore up the manpower shortage.
Though, to be honest, how the Institute was treating the Gen3s (literally disposable tools instead of sapient beings) will cause a Skynet, not the technology itself.
f1onagher
Well-known member
It's been so long since it's been discussed, but if I recall correctly China is in the middle of another three kingdoms era, with the rump communist state operating out of bunkers in the north and launching a new year zero every year, a United State of China in the east based on American troops stranded in China after the Great War, and a third (Imperial?) faction controlling the south. The NCR is collaborating with the American-descended Chinese I think?
Hey @Navarro, do you think people will start to divide the 1st, 2nd, and 3rd world nations by who has direct, indirect, and no access to fusion power? Given that all other energy sources are more or less tapped out.
TyrantTriumphant
Well-known member
The NCR is actually collaborating with the communist Chinese, not the republican Chinese. And there's a map of East Asia in the extras threadmarks if you want geographical details.
Crystonian
New member
Oh that's very interesting. This honestly gives the E-USA a lot more propaganda to feed to the masses. "NCR fighting side by side with the monsters that destroyed the world!"
TyrantTriumphant
Well-known member
It probably will when they find out. But the NCR is keeping it a secret for the moment.
liberty90
Evil Neoliberal Cat
What about something with sub-human intelligence for uses where death is highly probable, something like like robotic dogs for mass wave attack?
Well, of course they currently have Germans and English for this, lol.
ForeverShogo
Well-known member
And just for further clarity on the Earth 21X0 tangent.
Shit gets real bad. Global conflict fucks things hard, but the US had a robust enough missile shield that it wasn't as badly fucked as everyone else. US still collapses. Twelve former states band together to create the United Civilized States, but people had basically lost faith in politicians entirely by this point. A guy named Richard Bowman spearheads a movement that basically says that because power corrupts and those inclined to seek it are usually shitheels to begin with then the best government would be "a government that doesn't exist".
His critics say that somebody has to govern. His "solution" to that problem was to have a government made up of the fewest possible number of bureaucrats. With these positions being filled not by an election but a lottery system. They would also have extremely short terms of only a few months. With Bowman believing this would make it extraordinarily difficult for corruption to take root or any kind of political establishment to entrench itself.
Obviously most of these people would have no idea what the fuck they were doing, so they were given AI assistants that eventually developed to the point that they could effectively run the nation on their own. With it eventually getting to the point the humans in the government just go along with whatever the AI recommends. The UCS also developed robotics and automation and the like to the point that the human population basically all gets to live in luxury without needing to do any real work anymore.
Anyways, I always kind of found the UCS a little refreshing. Because they made it look like it was building towards a Skynet situation. Hell, their infantry in 2140 were just straight up T-800 endoskeletons from goddamn Terminator. And then it turned out the AI was actually pretty cool.
In theory the United States of this timeline could actually get to the same point of having robots and AI take care of all the tedious shit so all anyone has to worry about is the fun stuff . . . They already have pretty decent robots and AI, especially with whatever they learned from the Institute's synths. Though I can understand not going quite so far. It's a huge gamble. Someone might hope the result will be benevolent, but the risk that you'd just unleash Skynet or Skynet Lite or whatever would still be there. (Even the UCS gets in a tight spot because a randomly selected President was a programmer who fucked up trying to "improve" the AI in charge of the military, triggering a war that ultimately destroyed the Earth and forced everyone to flee to other worlds.)
Anyways . . . Aaron clearly knows this stuff, but others might not have known about the Earth 21X0 series.
Shit gets real bad. Global conflict fucks things hard, but the US had a robust enough missile shield that it wasn't as badly fucked as everyone else. US still collapses. Twelve former states band together to create the United Civilized States, but people had basically lost faith in politicians entirely by this point. A guy named Richard Bowman spearheads a movement that basically says that because power corrupts and those inclined to seek it are usually shitheels to begin with then the best government would be "a government that doesn't exist".
His critics say that somebody has to govern. His "solution" to that problem was to have a government made up of the fewest possible number of bureaucrats. With these positions being filled not by an election but a lottery system. They would also have extremely short terms of only a few months. With Bowman believing this would make it extraordinarily difficult for corruption to take root or any kind of political establishment to entrench itself.
Obviously most of these people would have no idea what the fuck they were doing, so they were given AI assistants that eventually developed to the point that they could effectively run the nation on their own. With it eventually getting to the point the humans in the government just go along with whatever the AI recommends. The UCS also developed robotics and automation and the like to the point that the human population basically all gets to live in luxury without needing to do any real work anymore.
Anyways, I always kind of found the UCS a little refreshing. Because they made it look like it was building towards a Skynet situation. Hell, their infantry in 2140 were just straight up T-800 endoskeletons from goddamn Terminator. And then it turned out the AI was actually pretty cool.
In theory the United States of this timeline could actually get to the same point of having robots and AI take care of all the tedious shit so all anyone has to worry about is the fun stuff . . . They already have pretty decent robots and AI, especially with whatever they learned from the Institute's synths. Though I can understand not going quite so far. It's a huge gamble. Someone might hope the result will be benevolent, but the risk that you'd just unleash Skynet or Skynet Lite or whatever would still be there. (Even the UCS gets in a tight spot because a randomly selected President was a programmer who fucked up trying to "improve" the AI in charge of the military, triggering a war that ultimately destroyed the Earth and forced everyone to flee to other worlds.)
Anyways . . . Aaron clearly knows this stuff, but others might not have known about the Earth 21X0 series.
f1onagher
Well-known member
That's right. Were the republicans not interested in trade? I can't imagine the people looting peasants from old bunkers have much to offer materially.
DarthAwesome
Relativistic Warfare Strategist
Well, this is why they developed the combat robot models, I think.
DarthOne
☦️
Aaron Fox
Well-known member
Given that PA requires a lot of resources to maintain properly? Likely we won't see one outside of propaganda unless it's one of those ramshackle things that the Commonwealth raiders use.
SuperHeavy
Well-known member
I like the tasteful cut before that man has his head pounded midway through his rib cage. PA in close combat is going to result in what would look like a set of horrific industrial accidents.
DarthOne
☦️
You assume they care about the lore enough to know about that.
They’ll throw in power armor because Fallout has power armor and it’s ‘iconic’ or whatever.
Navarro
Well-known member
It's not dead! Chapter Twenty-Nine is coming ASAP, just got some main characters in a tight spot I'm not sure how to get them out of.
==*==
Thousands of miles away, another leader was embroiled in a meeting of the National Security Council; an elite group of Executive Branch officials who were currently in one of the White House conference rooms. President Nathan J. Washington looked with tired eyes at the group; Sebastian McCain, Secretary of War; the Secretary of Homeland Security Helena Mellors, who oversaw the Joint Intelligence Chiefs along with other matters relating to border security and counterterrorism; the Secretaries of the Navy, Army and Air Force; and finally the National Security Advisor.
"Mr. Secretary," he said firmly, looking to the Secretary of the Navy. "In the worst-case scenario, is extraction of our forces in southern Texas and north Mexico possible?"
"Potentially, Mr. President," the man replied, reserved as ever. "We may be able to do a repeat of Dunkirk if it comes to that; but lightning doesn't strike twice, you know. The Caribbean Fleet will be able to deploy against the rebels when they're finished restocking on munitions at Havana; the Atlantic Fleet remains committed to protection of our merchant shipping. USS Nereid and Oceanid – the Liberty Star ocean liners we requisitioned – are almost ready to be deployed as hospital ships. But any such operation will be risky, Mr. President. We might lose more in the retreat to the coast than we would if we held our ground waiting for reinforcements."
Nate sighed. This war was quickly becoming more complex than what had initially been envisioned. Perhaps it was his age. He'd been in his twenties and early thirties when he'd served as an infantry officer against the Red Chinese, in Boston against the Brotherhood and the CIT and the super mutants, and finally in Canada against the "Ronto" rebels; now he was in his 70s, grey-haired, an elder statesman. Perhaps it was an atrophy of his skills; he'd spent far more years in politics by now than he'd ever spent on the battlefield. A cushy position in Autumn's administration followed by steady decades of easy electoral victories as a Federalist Senator for Massachusetts; maybe that'd softened him.
McCain spoke up next.
"The new tactical fusion weapons are due to-"
"Yes, the replacements for the Autumn-era plasma bombs. I've already cleared them for field deployment, we've both read the memos. High-explosive magnetic flux compression causing fusion of lithium deuteride, 40-80 tons of TNT equivalent. It's the same technique we use for our mini-nukes and larger nuclear weapons; Princeton's done the math, CIT's designed them, Oak Ridge is making them. That's enough for me."
McCain raised his voice again.
"Mr. President, I'd advise for the deployment of Chemical Corps assets in Texas."
"That's up to me and General Autumn, and neither of us is willing to deploy them right now. We've gotten backlash, and not just from the morons in CASE. The Vatican, the Hagia Sophia, the National Cathedral and at least one of the big-name preachers have all made statements against their use – and at any rate the NCR has switched to full CBRN protection."
There was another reason of course – the areas of the Chicago outskirts where poison gas had been deployed were still being cleaned up. It had been effective though; killing and maiming agents had slain or crippled thousands of NCR soldiers and panicked tens of thousands more – the mix of aerosolised green food colouring into the warheads had been an inspired touch, both marking out dangerous areas for the counter-attacking US troops and contributing to the near-rout that had prevented AFB O'Hare from falling, as NCR forces believed they were being hit with FEV.
"I'll issue a statement to mollify them. They'll know that the United States will respond to force with force, and the use of atomic, biological or chemical weapons with our own arsenals of such as tactical circumstances dictate. And of course – though I won't say it – if the Cali rebels cross the Mobile-Toronto Line I will immediately enact Operation Wormwood."
==*==
Thousands of miles away, another leader was embroiled in a meeting of the National Security Council; an elite group of Executive Branch officials who were currently in one of the White House conference rooms. President Nathan J. Washington looked with tired eyes at the group; Sebastian McCain, Secretary of War; the Secretary of Homeland Security Helena Mellors, who oversaw the Joint Intelligence Chiefs along with other matters relating to border security and counterterrorism; the Secretaries of the Navy, Army and Air Force; and finally the National Security Advisor.
"Mr. Secretary," he said firmly, looking to the Secretary of the Navy. "In the worst-case scenario, is extraction of our forces in southern Texas and north Mexico possible?"
"Potentially, Mr. President," the man replied, reserved as ever. "We may be able to do a repeat of Dunkirk if it comes to that; but lightning doesn't strike twice, you know. The Caribbean Fleet will be able to deploy against the rebels when they're finished restocking on munitions at Havana; the Atlantic Fleet remains committed to protection of our merchant shipping. USS Nereid and Oceanid – the Liberty Star ocean liners we requisitioned – are almost ready to be deployed as hospital ships. But any such operation will be risky, Mr. President. We might lose more in the retreat to the coast than we would if we held our ground waiting for reinforcements."
Nate sighed. This war was quickly becoming more complex than what had initially been envisioned. Perhaps it was his age. He'd been in his twenties and early thirties when he'd served as an infantry officer against the Red Chinese, in Boston against the Brotherhood and the CIT and the super mutants, and finally in Canada against the "Ronto" rebels; now he was in his 70s, grey-haired, an elder statesman. Perhaps it was an atrophy of his skills; he'd spent far more years in politics by now than he'd ever spent on the battlefield. A cushy position in Autumn's administration followed by steady decades of easy electoral victories as a Federalist Senator for Massachusetts; maybe that'd softened him.
McCain spoke up next.
"The new tactical fusion weapons are due to-"
"Yes, the replacements for the Autumn-era plasma bombs. I've already cleared them for field deployment, we've both read the memos. High-explosive magnetic flux compression causing fusion of lithium deuteride, 40-80 tons of TNT equivalent. It's the same technique we use for our mini-nukes and larger nuclear weapons; Princeton's done the math, CIT's designed them, Oak Ridge is making them. That's enough for me."
McCain raised his voice again.
"Mr. President, I'd advise for the deployment of Chemical Corps assets in Texas."
"That's up to me and General Autumn, and neither of us is willing to deploy them right now. We've gotten backlash, and not just from the morons in CASE. The Vatican, the Hagia Sophia, the National Cathedral and at least one of the big-name preachers have all made statements against their use – and at any rate the NCR has switched to full CBRN protection."
There was another reason of course – the areas of the Chicago outskirts where poison gas had been deployed were still being cleaned up. It had been effective though; killing and maiming agents had slain or crippled thousands of NCR soldiers and panicked tens of thousands more – the mix of aerosolised green food colouring into the warheads had been an inspired touch, both marking out dangerous areas for the counter-attacking US troops and contributing to the near-rout that had prevented AFB O'Hare from falling, as NCR forces believed they were being hit with FEV.
"I'll issue a statement to mollify them. They'll know that the United States will respond to force with force, and the use of atomic, biological or chemical weapons with our own arsenals of such as tactical circumstances dictate. And of course – though I won't say it – if the Cali rebels cross the Mobile-Toronto Line I will immediately enact Operation Wormwood."
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DarthAwesome
Relativistic Warfare Strategist
Well that's totally not ominous.
Sergeant Foley
Well-known member
Subscribed and following this timeline. Had no idea the kid's grandfather served as the longest-serving US President 😕