Religion The ethics of disowning degenerate family members

[LifeisTiresome]

"You disagree with me! You must be a mean old comnamist!"

I didn't call you a Nazi. I did say you were mindlessly absorbing Nazi nonsense, because that is true.

What am I supposed to say here? You're the one claiming "Cultural Marxism" is a real thing, but you can't explain it at all, and the one thing you said about men and white people giving their money away is completely unrelated to anything actual Marxists think.

I didn't call you Nazis but I can't stop talking about Nazis. Right.

Yes, its a real thing and I mentioned the oppressor and oppressed dynamic like the proletariat and bourgeoisie dynamic which is why I mentioned it. And I'm aware that there are old school marxists that care about class only for example. You see their types on Stupid Pol. They still believe the same thing Cultural marxists believe, they just care more about class.

 

[Shipmaster Sane]

Depends on what you mean by "stop". You stop having sex with dudes, but you can't quit wanting to. As all the guys who ran "conversion therapy" centers either admitting it didn't work or getting caught with rent boys proves.

So no one has ever exhibited limited homosexual attraction that then ceases or diminishes?

 

[LifeisTiresome]

Are you saying that someone can't, under any circumstances, stop being gay?

There are leftists who have made videos where if you are an incel, just go trans or be gay. Apparently thats a choice now despite leftists saying that its not a choice. They are full of contradictory bs.

 

[worm that walks]

I didn't call you Nazis but I can't stop talking about Nazis. Right.

Yes, its a real thing. And I'm aware that there are old school marxists that care about class only. You see their types on Stupid Pol. They still believe the same thing Cultural marxists believe, they just care more about class.

I'm saying this specific thing, which you are claiming is true, was come up with by the Nazis. If I thought you were a Nazi, why would I point that out? I expect Nazis to be into Nazi shit. I don't expect other people to be.

And "caring about more than class" isn't "Cultural Marxism". Unless you think every civil rights activist was a cultural Marxist, in which case "cultural Marxism" just means antiracism.

There are leftists who have made videos where if you are an incel, just go trans or be gay. Apparently thats a choice now despite leftists saying that its not a choice. They are full of contradictory bs.

Yes, they are.

So no one has ever exhibited limited homosexual attraction that then ceases or diminishes?

Sure. Doesn't mean you can choose for it to happen. Most old dudes have diminished heterosexual attraction. Doesn't mean they decided to stop being straight.

 

[LifeisTiresome]

I'm saying this specific thing, which you are claiming is true, was come up with by the Nazis. If I thought you were a Nazi, why would I point that out? I expect Nazis to be into Nazi shit. I don't expect other people to be.

And "caring about more than class" isn't "Cultural Marxism". Unless you think every civil rights activist was a cultural Marxist, in which case "cultural Marxism" just means antiracism.

Endless talking about nazis. Will you be quiet already about that? I don't care if the Nazis offend you.

Its more then anti-racism and they are racist. Its hatred of families, hatred of men, hatred of heterosexuals, hatred of gamers, hatred of beauty and they are marxists in economic sense too and cultural sense cause of the mentioned and how they are all oppressors and they are the oppressed like the proletariat and bourgeiosie. But no, its just economic

 

[worm that walks]

Endless talking about nazis. Will you be quiet already about that? I don't care if the Nazis offend you.

Its more then anti-racism. Its hatred of families, hatred of men, hatred of heterosexuals, hatred of gamers, hatred of beauty and they are marxists in economic sense too and cultural sense cause of the mentioned and how they are all oppressors and they are the oppressed like the proletariat and bourgeiosie. But no, its just economic

This is the funniest goddamned thing I have seen in ages.

 

[LifeisTiresome]

This is the funniest goddamned thing I have seen in ages.

Yes, yes, its economic and even though its tenents are being used in other places and the people pushing those things are marxists too. It doesn't exist cause Muh Nazi's

And yes, have you seen how they say gamers are evil and how gamers are responsible for global warming?

 

[worm that walks]

Yes, yes, its economic and even though its tenents are being used in other places and the people pushing those things are marxists too. It doesn't exist cause Muh Nazi's

And yes, have you seen how they say gamers are evil and how gamers are responsible for global warming?

Okay buddy. Don't worry. We won't let the big bad Marxist take your video games!

 

[LifeisTiresome]

Okay buddy. Don't worry. We won't let the big bad Marxist take your video games!

They can't. I pirate my games. This is what I find so vile about you leftists. You claim to hate stereotypes but love stereotyping people. You claim to hate people being attacked or bullied but love doing it.

 

[worm that walks]

They can't. I pirate my games. This is what I find so vile about you leftists. You claim to hate stereotypes but love stereotyping people. You claim to hate people being attacked or bullied but love doing it.

This is beautiful. You claim I call everyone I disagree with a Nazi, despite my having called no one a Nazi.

Meanwhile, you call me a leftist over and over again, because I don't believe your bullshit conspiracy theory that a bunch of Jewish Hegelians from the 1930s hate you for your video games.

If I thought you were capable of self-reflection I'd feel embarrassed for you.

 

[LifeisTiresome]

This is beautiful. You claim I call everyone I disagree with a Nazi, despite my having called no one a Nazi.

Meanwhile, you call me a leftist over and over again, because I don't believe your bullshit conspiracy theory that a bunch of Jewish Hegelians from the 1930s hate you for your video games.

If I thought you were capable of self-reflection I'd feel embarrassed for you.

You can't stop going on about them. I believe that you do think we are that but won't outright say that.

And yes, I can call you whatever I want. You can do the same. Thats your right.

And I don't care what you think of me. Again, I have even elaborated on the Oppressor and Oppressed thing but you still ignore it. Anyway, this is a pointless talk. You have nothing to say but say nazi and conspiracy.

 

[worm that walks]

You can't stop going on about them. I believe that you do think we are that but won't outright say that.

And yes, I can call you whatever I want. You can do the same. Thats your right.

And I don't care what you think of me. Again, I have even elaborated on the Oppressor and Oppressed thing but you still ignore it. Anyway, this is a pointless talk. You have nothing to say but say nazi and conspiracy.

I'm specifically arguing that this thing you believe is nonsense made up by the Nazis. That does require me to mention them.

You can call me whatever you want. And I can laugh at you for lacking self-awareness. See how that works out?

And you didn't "elaborate" on jack shit. I'm guessing because you lack even the slightest idea what you are talking about. If you think Marxism means you don't like the rich, and cultural Marxism is where you don't like cultural stuff, then how am I supposed to contend with that level of self-assured ignorance.

You're right about this being pointless though. It wastes my time and annoys the pig.

 

[LifeisTiresome]

I'm specifically arguing that this thing you believe is nonsense made up by the Nazis. That does require me to mention them.

You can call me whatever you want. And I can laugh at you for lacking self-awareness. See how that works out?

And you didn't "elaborate" on jack shit. I'm guessing because you lack even the slightest idea what you are talking about. If you think Marxism means you don't like the rich, and cultural Marxism is where you don't like cultural stuff, then how am I supposed to contend with that level of self-assured ignorance.

You're right about this being pointless though. It wastes my time and annoys the pig.

I elaborated it clearly for you. You don't get it cause you don't want to. Just keep calling it conspiracy even though its everywhere like a good sheep or lefty. And yes call me whatever you want or laugh at me. Should I give a shit?

 

[ShieldWife]

"Cultural Marxism" is the idea that a bunch of German Hegelians from the 1930s are secretly masterminding the fall of western civilizations. You think it is a coincidence that the conspiracy theory happens to claim a bunch of Jewish guys the Nazis were mad at are the problem. Neo-Nazis warmed up some of old uncle Adolph's left overs and a bunch of morons uncritically adopted it

Oh no, you said Nazis, I guess you win the argument!

Cultural Marxism describes a set of far left social views that are known by a variety of names like social justice, intersectionality, critical theory, and likely others I can't recall off the top of my head. Maybe "Cultural Marxism" isn't the best term for this ideology, but because the believers often try to obfuscate their beliefs and agenda, their opponents needed to come up with words to identify the movement.

Maybe "Cultural Marxism" isn't an ideal phrase, but it does draw upon the ideology's history. Which does include Marxists who wanted to extend the class struggle to include demographic groups like gender, race, or sexual preferences. This includes but is not limited to the Frankfurt School. Now, like I said, maybe the term isn't the best one we could be using, but just because some of the important figures in what people call Cultural Marxism were Jews or that Nazis also didn't like them doesn't mean that that it's some kind of anti-Semitic conspiracy theory.

To say that anybody claims that 1930's Hegelians are masterminding the fall of society is a strawman of such epic proportions that there should be a sacrifice inside of it.

Drop the Nazi BS, it's not impressing anybody here. It's a tangent anyway.

Do you think the victims of pedophiles are usually happy? Do you think people in abusive relationships are happy? If not, then where is the contradiction with what I said?

I didn't mention pedophilia. I mentioned a 13 year old having sex, which could be with another 13 year old, and I mentioned a 16 year old with a 50 year old which is not pedophilia and is in fact legal in most US states and nations around the world. Both of those coupling could make the people involved happy, though they have big problems too and could cause damage down the road. Are people in abusive relationships happy? Sometimes they are, at least temporarily.

There are countless things that young people could do that makes them happy in the short term but that could be destructive in the long term. That is why parents put restrictions on kids in countless ways. Why parents don't let kids eat ice cream for every meal or stay up every night to 4 AM playing video games. Along the same lines, the parent of a minor should put restrictions on who their children have relationships with, and even if the child is a legal adult and the parents can't force them to do anything, they should still offer guidance or even criticism of their relationship choices.

To say that parents should be alright with anybody their kids have sex with as long as the kid is happy is the height of absurdity.

The difference is that people who care what religion or race or economic status their kids partner has are concerned about things that don't actually touch on their ability to be a good partner. If you think dating a black person or a man is going to ruin your son's life, that is a really dumb position. You've basically admitted this comes down to whatever irrational prejudices the parents have being grounds to kick their kid out of the house.

I never said that parents should kick their kids out of the house! I have disagreed with doing that multiple times!

I said that different parents have different kinds of objections to sexual (and hopefully also romantic) partners that their children may pick. A parent who didn't care at all would be insane. Any parent is going to have some things that they find troubling for ideological or potentially subjective reasons. If you had a teenage child and you heard their boyfriend or girlfriend refer to someone as a Cultural Marxist, that might cause you some concern. Parents whose kids select partners that they have a problem with are right to express their misgivings or even take action to oppose those relationships, even if you happen to disagree with their criteria for judging those partners.

 

[Morphic Tide]

I'm specifically arguing that this thing you believe is nonsense made up by the Nazis. That does require me to mention them.

To add another person giving their opinion on what "Cultural Marxism" is, the matter of it is that Marxism is a branch of socio-economic theory that has a heavy concern with much wider aspects of society than merely the mode of distribution of goods. It very much calls for an overhaul of political systems and societal functions, all surrounding the supposed conflict between Bourgeoisie and Proletariat.

Cultural Marxism is referring to the broadening of scope from just Business-Owner vs. Worker to cover race and sexuality, eventually expanding into modern Intersectionality where every discrete characteristic is subject to such an analysis, such that all aspects of culture receive a variant of Oppressor vs. Oppressed narrative. The root has been more or less buried under all these additional factors of discussion, which is how the backers allowing this to run free like it because they are very firmly the Bourgeoisie that'd be getting lynched if actual Marxists were roaming the streets.

 

[ShieldWife]

Yes, exactly as Morphic Tide says.

Cultural Marxism maybe isn't what we should be calling it, but it's not a nonsensical idea. It's extending the class struggle of the proletariat against the bourgeoisie to supposedly oppressed demographics. It's not just the poor overthrowing the rich to create our Marxist utopia, it's females overthrowing males, it's blacks overthrowing whites, and so on. It's been insidiously effective too, because the modern left can essentially lick the boots of big corporations and billionaires while pretending to fight oppression for being sexist against men and racist against whites.

 

[worm that walks]

To add another person giving their opinion on what "Cultural Marxism" is, the matter of it is that Marxism is a branch of socio-economic theory that has a heavy concern with much wider aspects of society than merely the mode of distribution of goods. It very much calls for an overhaul of political systems and societal functions, all surrounding the supposed conflict between Bourgeoisie and Proletariat.

Cultural Marxism is referring to the broadening of scope from just Business-Owner vs. Worker to cover race and sexuality, eventually expanding into modern Intersectionality where every discrete characteristic is subject to such an analysis, such that all aspects of culture receive a variant of Oppressor vs. Oppressed narrative. The root has been more or less buried under all these additional factors of discussion, which is how the backers allowing this to run free like it because they are very firmly the Bourgeoisie that'd be getting lynched if actual Marxists were roaming the streets.

Or maybe people just don't think being gay is a big deal without giving two shits what some dead fucks from Germany in the 19th century said about the means of production? I'm sure there are all sorts of people with stupid ideas about these things, but that doesn't mean everybody who isn't scared of the gays destroying society agrees with those people.

Marxism doesn't even talk much about oppression. Marxist concern is mostly "exploitation", which they use to mean something very technical and rather dumb. But it has to do with how wealth is extracted from capital and labor.

Intersectional feminism is a real thing, and cultural Marxism isn't. If people are scared of intersectional feminists, they should say so, instead of trying to dress it up in anti-Semitic conspiracy language from a century ago.

 

[Morphic Tide]

Or maybe people just don't think being gay is a big deal without giving two shits what some dead fucks from Germany in the 19th century said about the means of production?

The two points are that the rhetoric, outside exact subject matter, lines up frequently with actual orthodox Marxism, and that we are generally discussing lunatic extremists who are violently hostile to mere tolerance like just not thinking it's a big deal.

Where Marxists discuss "Exploitation", Intersectionalists tend to speak very similarly of "oppression" or "bigotry". Intersectionalists personally not giving two shits about Karl Marx in particular does not mean in the slightest that Marx's writings aren't an influence on them.

If people are scared of intersectional feminists, they should say so, instead of trying to dress it up in anti-Semitic conspiracy language from a century ago.

Maybe stop getting so anal about terminology overlap and focus on the actual opinions being expressed? Like, if I started talking about the Chinese being exploitative assholes in Africa, would you think I was discussing Marxist theory just because there's superficial similarities in the terms used?

There's a difference between the connections being made, in that you have just buzzword overlap, while we're identifying very broad subject matters with uncanny similarities and the origins of the movements. You're getting on us for using the term "Cultural Marxism", we're getting on the Intersectionalists over the Frankfurt School.

 

[worm that walks]

The two points are that the rhetoric, outside exact subject matter, lines up frequently with actual orthodox Marxism, and that we are discussing lunatic extremists who are violently hostile to mere tolerance like just not thinking it's a big deal.

Where Marxists discuss "Exploitation", Intersectionalists tend to speak very similarly of "oppression" or "bigotry". Intersectionalists personally not giving two shits about Karl Marx in particular does not mean in the slightest that Marx's writings aren't an influence on them.


Maybe stop getting so anal about terminology overlap and focus on the actual opinions being expressed? Like, if I started talking about the Chinese being exploitative assholes in Africa, would you think I was discussing Marxist theory just because there's superficial similarities in rhetoric?

There's a difference between the connections being made, in that you have just buzzword overlap, while we're identifying very broad subject matters with uncanny similarities and the origins of the movements. You're getting on us for using the term "Cultural Marxism", we're getting on the Intersectionalists over the Frankfurt School.

Somebody called me a "Sexual Bolshevik". I looked it up, it was a term the Nazis used. I just kinda rolled my eyes and was ready to move on. Somebody else jumps in and says "the Nazis came up with Cultural Marxism, and that's real". At which point I said that no, it isn't, and that thinking otherwise was stupid. At which point people kept jumping out of the woodwork to claim I was calling them Nazis and also that the Nazis didn't come up with the term. Which is weird because they didn't bother to say that to the person I was replying to.

The problem with all this is that supposedly these "cultural Marxists" are powerful and dangerous and are destroying society. But then they are also supposed to be a lunatic fringe that doesn't even understand their own ideology.

People can just think being gay is fine without being part of the Illuminati or whatever shit you think is going on. Deciding everyone who disagrees with you is part of a sinister cabal out to destroy everything good is not healthy.

I said that different parents have different kinds of objections to sexual (and hopefully also romantic) partners that their children may pick. A parent who didn't care at all would be insane. Any parent is going to have some things that they find troubling for ideological or potentially subjective reasons. If you had a teenage child and you heard their boyfriend or girlfriend refer to someone as a Cultural Marxist, that might cause you some concern. Parents whose kids select partners that they have a problem with are right to express their misgivings or even take action to oppose those relationships, even if you happen to disagree with their criteria for judging those partners.

Not really. I expect teenagers to have stupid political opinions.

 

[Abhorsen]

The problem with all this is that supposedly these "cultural Marxists" are powerful and dangerous and are destroying society. But then they are also supposed to be a lunatic fringe that doesn't even understand their own ideology.

The problem is that the term Cultural Marxism is basically the right's way of referring to critical theory. A lot of the argument here is just people disagreeing what to call it.

And cultural marxism is an apt name for critical theory, if it didn't also have the historical context. The idea of critical theory, as envisioned by its creators, was to use the marxist way of looking at the world as oppressed and oppressors (which is how they do it. Economically, this becomes exploited and exploiters), and apply it to culture, and divorce it from economics (which I'd argue it can't be, but that's an academic debate not for here). The problem with critical theory, and the problem with Marxist economics in general, is that most relationships are mutually beneficial, without an oppressor and oppressed or exploiter and exploited.