The Political Problem of Pornography

Val the Moofia Boss

Val the Moofia Boss

Well-known member
I think pornography is a symptom of a bigger problem. People are turning to porn because it's fulfilling a desire they aren't getting: intimacy. Why are they turning to porn to get intimacy, over actually hooking up with people? Probably because of the atomized state of society (ie, you live in apartment or in an urban neighborhood and there is no community: you have nothing in common with your next door neighbors, and even if you did, the nature of the economy means that they move in and out every few months or years and you never see them again). There is also the economic reality, where it's just incredibly difficult to own a house and have a family, which is sort of a pre-requisite for getting into a committed relationship with the intention of having a family in the first place. By the time you have your student debt paid off and have managed to get yourself into a position where you can buy a house and raise a family, you're a man well into his 30s or 40s.

People aren't built to be islands. No one can last that long without intimacy. They're going to try to seek out some sort of substitute to fulfill that desire. So they turn to porn, or casual sex relationships, or prostitution.

Also sucks that Evangelical Churches have been absolutely awful at addressing sex. They tell you "don't do sex until you're married", (which is a good thing!), but that statement in of itself doesn't resolve people's desire for intimacy at all. Churches separate bible study groups by gender and age, so young men don't get to hang around older married men and find role models for guidance, and if you try finding a woman at Church to be your wife, you get kicked out. "The church isn't a place for you to find a wife!". Talk about being tone deaf. And sexual sin has been stigmatized as this ultimate sin to the point that you have dozens and dozens of people going to church who are addicts, but no one is going to admit that they have a problem, so it is never addressed.

Also doesn't help that the culture likes to portray "getting into a relationship" as a life goal to check off, not as a commitment to take seriously.
 
Bacle

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Val the Moofia Boss said:
I think pornography is a symptom of a bigger problem. People are turning to porn because it's fulfilling a desire they aren't getting: intimacy. Why are they turning to porn to get intimacy, over actually hooking up with people? Probably because of the atomized state of society (ie, you live in apartment or in an urban neighborhood and there is no community: you have nothing in common with your next door neighbors, and even if you did, the nature of the economy means that they move in and out every few months or years and you never see them again). There is also the economic reality, where it's just incredibly difficult to own a house and have a family, which is sort of a pre-requisite for getting into a committed relationship with the intention of having a family in the first place. By the time you have your student debt paid off and have managed to get yourself into a position where you can buy a house and raise a family, you're a man well into his 30s or 40s.

People aren't built to be islands. No one can last that long without intimacy. They're going to try to seek out some sort of substitute to fulfill that desire. So they turn to porn, or casual sex relationships, or prostitution.

Also sucks that Evangelical Churches have been absolutely awful at addressing sex. They tell you "don't do sex until you're married", (which is a good thing!), but that statement in of itself doesn't resolve people's desire for intimacy at all. Churches separate bible study groups by gender and age, so young men don't get to hang around older married men and find role models for guidance, and if you try finding a woman at Church to be your wife, you get kicked out. "The church isn't a place for you to find a wife!". Talk about being tone deaf. And sexual sin has been stigmatized as this ultimate sin to the point that you have dozens and dozens of people going to church who are addicts, but no one is going to admit that they have a problem, so it is never addressed.

Also doesn't help that the culture likes to portray "getting into a relationship" as a life goal to check off, not as a commitment to take seriously.
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Yep; people harping on porn as an issue don't seem to get the real issues causing problems are economic, or economically derived, for the most part.

But economic issues are tricky, complicated, and require multi-prong approaches to address, as well as an ability to accept that trying to rewind the clock isn't feasible.

So much easier to just bitch about porn and the Sexual Revolution, which let's them feel good and righteous while doing nothing meaningful to address the underlying issues actually cause most of the problems with modern society that they bitch about.

Edit: Then again, I guess actually expecting the type that harp on the porn issue to have useful political or social plans or strategies for the modern day is like expecting an Iowa-class battleship to be a relevant force in modern naval combat. Sure, with a lot of work, modifications, and manpower, they could be moderately useful.

But they are left as museums for a reason; time has simply passed them by. Same with the people who think going after porn is at all useful politically.
 
FriedCFour

FriedCFour

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Abhorsen said:
See, my society (America, FUCK YEAH) depends on freedom of speech. It's right in one of its founding documents. There's more than one way to kill America, and you are proposing one right now.
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“America dies if 11 year olds aren’t regularly and habitually consuming internet pornography”

Abhorsen said:
The fact that you refer to America's bill of rights as 'muh freedoms'
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I refer to championing internet porn as that, and decrying those who want to limit it as “un-American”. Your standards for what is un-American make the vast majority those who both created the constitution and founded America and made up its population Un-American.


Abhorsen said:
and I hope you are not American, because it shows how little you care about America and her values.
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I am and I care vastly more than you ever will. You don’t care in the slightest about the value of Christianity we were founded on, I don’t care about the value of internet pornography that we weren’t founded on.
 
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LordsFire

LordsFire

Internet Wizard
Abhhorsen, would you support a law making it illegal to expose minors to pornography, much like it is illegal to give a minor cigarettes, alochol in most places, or make sexual advances on them?
 
GoldRanger

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Fleiur said:
www.dailymail.co.uk

Sex-addict gunman targeted massage parlors to 'remove temptation'

Robert Aaron Long, 21, has been captured in southwest Georgia, hours after eight people were killed in shootings at three Atlanta-area massage parlors.
www.dailymail.co.uk

Obviously, this is not Asian hate or racism towards Asians. This crime is evil. However, this man has a pornography problem that led him to become a sex addict. That should be the main takeaway from this incident. Pornography and its effect on our society and in men should be what we are discussing.

As we all know, pornography by its nature dehumanizes and degrades both the viewer and the viewed. Both are lessened by the experience.
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"Porn made him do it".

Yeah, sure. Violent video games too, I take it? Or maybe he needed more Jesus in his life?

GTFO
 
Captain X

Captain X

Well-known member
Osaul
Yeah, this is no different than any other example of someone trying to shift the blame off of themselves. Next he'll be claiming the devil made him do it. This is a person who externalized their problems, and focused them on this parlor rather than doing any kind of self-examination. He's the kind of person who would blame someone else for the fact that they got caught doing something against the rules or law. Like a bully who blames their victim when they get in trouble with the teacher and beats them up after school.

Frankly the people who advocate against porn and sex work are only embarrassing themselves. The ironic thing is that it's something the leftists agree with them on, and it comes down to demonizing sexuality and the expression of it, an viewing women as if they were perpetual children.
 
GoldRanger

GoldRanger

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Captain X said:
Yeah, this is no different than any other example of someone trying to shift the blame off of themselves. Next he'll be claiming the devil made him do it. This is a person who externalized their problems, and focused them on this parlor rather than doing any kind of self-examination. He's the kind of person who would blame someone else for the fact that they got caught doing something against the rules or law. Like a bully who blames their victim when they get in trouble with the teacher and beats them up after school.

Frankly the people who advocate against porn and sex work are only embarrassing themselves. The ironic thing is that it's something the leftists agree with them on, and it comes down to demonizing sexuality and the expression of it, an viewing women as if they were perpetual children.
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The anti-porn crowd are being pretty damn leftish about this whole issue. Pushing a grossly illiberal stance in the name of bettering society while inventing made-up words inside their clique to describe that evil thing they don't like ("coomer" for example). Both sides represent the same kind of mentality and should be utterly destroyed as far as I'm concerned.
 
FriedCFour

FriedCFour

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Captain X said:
Yeah, this is no different than any other example of someone trying to shift the blame off of themselves. Next he'll be claiming the devil made him do it. This is a person who externalized their problems, and focused them on this parlor rather than doing any kind of self-examination. He's the kind of person who would blame someone else for the fact that they got caught doing something against the rules or law. Like a bully who blames their victim when they get in trouble with the teacher and beats them up after school.
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How much blame does an addict have if the addiction started at 11?

Frankly the people who advocate against porn and sex work are only embarrassing themselves. The ironic thing is that it's something the leftists agree with them on, and it comes down to demonizing sexuality and the expression of it, an viewing women as if they were perpetual children.
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Lol. Its fucking not at all. Leftists love only fans. There’s a small cut of older people like Radfems that aren’t but the majority will tell you “sex work is real work.”
 
Abhorsen

Abhorsen

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LordsFire said:
Abhhorsen, would you support a law making it illegal to expose minors to pornography, much like it is illegal to give a minor cigarettes, alochol in most places, or make sexual advances on them?
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Sure, in theory. My issue is with adults here. In practice, this leads to problems. What's porn? Renaissance paintings in museums? Artsy photos in a gallery? And what does exposing constitute? A kid sneaking into their parents room to look at Playboys? A site doing really careful checks to determine age, which inevitably cause privacy concerns for adults?

FriedCFour said:
“America dies if 11 year olds aren’t regularly and habitually consuming internet pornography”
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I never said anything about 11 year olds.

FriedCFour said:
I refer to championing internet porn as that, and decrying those who want to limit it as “un-American”. Your standards for what is un-American make the vast majority those who both created the constitution and founded America and made up its population Un-American.
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You don't seem to understand that while America in its constitution made great promises, it didn't much stick to them for a very long while, notably the Alien and Sedition act. Also, the constitution originally mostly only applied to the federal government, not the state. But they did write down what they meant, and it included freedom of speech. My standards for what is and isn't un-American are quite simple, and they are laid out in the constitution. You've presented no argument that porn isn't somehow speech or press. You just say it's harmful, but newsflash, the founders new 'harmful' speech would happen. They wanted it legal.

FriedCFour said:
I am and I care vastly more than you ever will. You don’t care in the slightest about the value of Christianity we were founded on, I don’t care about the value of internet pornography that we weren’t founded on.
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I care about the founding document, while you apparently want to toss it away to institute a theocracy. You don't seem to understand that when they had the option, the founders thought that was so fucking stupid they made laws to stop it.
 
Fleiur

Fleiur

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Abhorsen said:
I mean, that's the point about America. You are free to do stupid things. You still haven't made a good point about porn being different from other speech.
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Clearly, you don't know how to read. My main point in my OP was that the main cause of his actions was his pornography problem and sex addiction. It is what is supposed to be discussed in the mainstream media.
As we all know, they are saying it's Asian hate and racism towards Asians. They do not want to cast shade on one of their sacred cows. The only evil in their minds is racism. Therefore, when something evil happens, its racism. Talk of mental illness and sex addiction is heresy to them.
 
Abhorsen

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Fleiur said:
Did I say that? I'm just pointing out that that sex addiction played a major role in his motivation, and it should be discussed in the mainstream media. He himself said it was his motivation.
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No, it very much shouldn't be discussed. It sets a bad precedent if we discuss a murderers motive and if something should be done about it. It gives political power to evil people.

It means the next time someone thinks they see a huge problem with society, they'll think that if they do mass murder because of it, it might lead to progress.
 
Abhorsen

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Fleiur said:
Clearly, you don't know how to read. My main point in my OP was that the main cause of his actions was his pornography problem and sex addiction. It is what is supposed to be discussed in the mainstream media.
As we all know, they are saying it's Asian hate and racism towards Asians. They do not want to cast shade on one of their sacred cows. The only evil in their minds is racism. Therefore, when something evil happens, its racism. Talk of mental illness and sex addiction is heresy to them.
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I wasn't even talking about pornography in that quote. Here's what I was responding to in full:
Fleiur said:
Abhorsen said:
People were successfully convicted for organizing a Communist Party as late as 1951.
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A pity that stopped.
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See, here you were advocating for restricting political speech, which just goes to point out the problem of prohibiting porn. You don't want to stop there. People who want to ban porn usually want to keep going and ban politics they don't agree with, and everything else they don't agree with too. You just are using porn as the first step down the slippery slope, just like the left uses racist language.
 
Bacle

Bacle

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Fleiur said:
Clearly, you don't know how to read. My main point in my OP was that the main cause of his actions was his pornography problem and sex addiction. It is what is supposed to be discussed in the mainstream media.
As we all know, they are saying it's Asian hate and racism towards Asians. They do not want to cast shade on one of their sacred cows. The only evil in their minds is racism. Therefore, when something evil happens, its racism. Talk of mental illness and sex addiction is heresy to them.
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You are acting like the idiots who wanted to blame 'violent video games' for the Columbine shooting.

It was dumb then, it's dumb now.

Do you like it when the Left uses any shooting, outside of urban ghettos (which they ignore for narrative purposes), to push for more anti-gun laws?

Because that is exactly what you trying to use this incident to harp on porn looks like, and is no less disgusting.
 
Fleiur

Fleiur

Well-known member
Abhorsen said:
No, it very much shouldn't be discussed. It sets a bad precedent if we discuss a murderers motive and if something should be done about it. It gives political power to evil people.

It means the next time someone thinks they see a huge problem with society, they'll think that if they do mass murder because of it, it might lead to progress.
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That's the truth. It's either we discuss the truth or the nonexistent racism which again, as we all know this evil is not racism towards Asians.
 
Abhorsen

Abhorsen

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Fleiur said:
Well, it's his motive, whether you like it or not.
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And? I still see no reason it should be discussed outside of it being the motive. We don't consider banning drawing Mohammed when someone's head is cutoff for discussing it, why should we consider the possible harm of pornography now? It's despicable to give that evil man anything useful.
 
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