United States Biden administration policies and actions - megathread

Megadeath

Well-known member
What exactly is stopping china from just... ignoring the intellectual property rights and simply operating those fabs with non american employees? (chinese, german, swedes, japanese, indian, and so on and so on. lots of countries have tech engineers)

are we going to get chinese bootleg !AMD/!intel chips soon?
America has a disproportionate representation in the better people in the field. Taiwan too, but not much chance they'll be picking up the slack! It also isn't just the jobs, but any tech, equipment, tools etc. and no American entity can provide any support without permission. So, no carrying trade, insurance, financial services... And even if every element can be replaced with time, it completely guts their current model. They're not going to be starting from the ground floor but they've taken a big step back.
 

LordsFire

Internet Wizard
What exactly is stopping china from just... ignoring the intellectual property rights and simply operating those fabs with non american employees? (chinese, german, swedes, japanese, indian, and so on and so on. lots of countries have tech engineers)

are we going to get chinese bootleg !AMD/!intel chips soon?

They lack the expertise, they lack the quality control, their corruption cripples their ability to build up either of those, and without sourcing tooling from the US or Taiwan, they're not going to be able to replace the equipment as it starts to break down.
 

Sergeant Foley

Well-known member
Depends on how egotistical he is. Only a true egoist would push the button, it's the ultimate power trip, the final revenge of a dying man against a cruel world that refuses to recognize your genius.
I am 100% pulling for the Ukrainians all the way.
 

mrttao

Well-known member
They lack the expertise, they lack the quality control, their corruption cripples their ability to build up either of those, and without sourcing tooling from the US or Taiwan, they're not going to be able to replace the equipment as it starts to break down.
They literally have factories with employees of various nationalities producing those goods in china right now.
Only the USA citizens working in those chinese factories quit.

It is utterly delusional to think only USA citizens can have expertise and that all other people were just there to make coffee and give blowjobs to the glorious USA citizens who did all the thinky work.
fear of retaliation like before
That is them retaliating against the USA.
The USA just started shit. if they don't retaliate they will look weak as well as suffer economically, and the CCP can't afford to look weak.
Additionally it is specifically meant to neuter their military
The USA economy is already on the ropes, and will not survive a trade war with china right now.
 

LordsFire

Internet Wizard
They literally have factories with employees of various nationalities producing those goods in china right now.
Only the USA citizens working in those chinese factories quit.

It is utterly delusional to think only USA citizens can have expertise and that all other people were just there to make coffee and give blowjobs to the glorious USA citizens who did all the thinky work.

You are acting like there's more in common than there actually is, and over-simplifying on top of that.

How many countries in the world design cutting-edge microchips?

How many countries in the world build cutting-edge microchips?

How many countries in the world make the tooling that microchip foundries run on?


The list answers to each of those is very short, and the only place that does all three was the US, until Intel's attempt to produce the latest generation of smaller dies failed, though I've heard they're catching up. Nobody else even approaches doing all three.

China has spent billions of dollars and a decade+ trying to match western, Taiwanese, and South Korean chip fabrication standards.

They've failed.

They have to import talent, designs, and tooling, to produce stuff that fills out the middle end of the market, without that all they have left is the crappy chips that go into your smart TV, smart coffee machine, etc, etc. They may not even be able to keep that up without all that imported talent.

Up through the 90's and into the 2000's, AMD and Intel both produced in the USA. That started moving overseas, but it's already in the process of starting to move back, and the designs and tooling are still developed in the USA.

China doesn't have a stable of European firms and talent that can replace what the US has withdrawn. If they scrape and reach, they can probably replace a small fraction of mid-grade production with European support, but Intel and AMD are both American companies, and the producers of secondary and supporting chips and chipsets tend to be American or Japanese/Korean/Taiwanese.

There are some European firms, unlike the industrial revolution, the digital age took off in America, and has been an American game since day one. There's a reason that there's no European firm offering to build the EU's 5G infrastructure. There's a reason that while 2-3G cell phones were produced by companies all over the world, smartphones narrowed down to a handful of manufacturers, Samsung, Apple, Huawei, and maybe one or two others having a meaningful percentage of the market.

The cutting edge of microchips is just about the most brutal business to be in. Each iterative generation of design costs billions to research and develop, and if a design fails, you have to either sink that much money into a new one, or go out of business altogether.

As soon as you finish one generation of development, you need to both keep a team dedicated to refining that chip/chipset, and launch the next R&D cycle, because you can damn well bet that the competition is too.

Ever computer, every car, ever smartphone, every piece of advanced industrial machinery, every piece of advanced military hardware, all of these industries are incredibly hungry for either the absolute cutting edge, the reliable and ruggedized version of last generation's tech, or both at the same time for different applications.


TL;DR: This is not an industry that you can just hire someone else to do the job. There's 2-4 sources of competent talent who are on top of the game, and those are all in the US, Taiwan, and Korea. The runners up are in those nations plus Japan. If anyone else has that level of capability, I've not heard of it, and when the US pulls out of China, you can bet your ass none of those other three are going to take a shot at it.

Your alternatives from Europe are going at least two generations of technology back, and by the time you've managed to copy off of them, you'll be another generation back.
 

mrttao

Well-known member
You are acting like there's more in common than there actually is, and over-simplifying on top of that.

How many countries in the world design cutting-edge microchips?

How many countries in the world build cutting-edge microchips?

How many countries in the world make the tooling that microchip foundries run on?
1. To answer your questions, several dozens of countries do.

2. you are clearly conflating USA ownership of intel as the USA being the only country populated by people smart enough to do computer engineering. But most of the engineering is not done in USA itself.
This ownership is due to the fact penetrating the market is neigh impossible and protected by countless international patents.

3. USA actually is not even the sole owner of CPU manufacturing anymore. Aside from there being several competitors (almost all cellphones use ARM which is UK company. and you now have ARM based laptops such as the samsung go)
there is also the fact that AMD got sold to united arab emirates.

4. The reason USA historically owned such key companies have far more to do with USA hegemony rather than innate superior intellect of americans.
 

mrttao

Well-known member
China has spent billions of dollars and a decade+ trying to match western, Taiwanese, and South Korean chip fabrication standards.

They've failed.
I don't know how to break it to you. But korea, taiwan, and europe are not part of the USA.

Biden only kicked out USA citizens from chinese factories. All other westerners, taiwanese, and koreans are still employeed there.

Even if you ignore intel's massive amount of chinese researchers and instead are racist and believe that chinese are stupid and can't make chips... they don't actually need to. Because they still have access to literally the entire western world, except the USA. This was a unilateral decision by biden alone, not a NATO decision binding all NATO nations.
 

LordsFire

Internet Wizard
1. To answer your questions, several dozens of countries do.

2. you are clearly conflating USA ownership of intel as the USA being the only country populated by people smart enough to do computer engineering. But most of the engineering is not done in USA itself.
This ownership is due to the fact penetrating the market is neigh impossible and protected by countless international patents.

3. USA actually is not even the sole owner of CPU manufacturing anymore. Aside from there being several competitors (almost all cellphones use ARM which is UK company. and you now have ARM based laptops such as the samsung go)
there is also the fact that AMD got sold to united arab emirates.

4. The reason USA historically owned such key companies have far more to do with USA hegemony rather than innate superior intellect of americans.
1. No, they don't. People from several dozen countries do, that's not the same thing as the legal framework and infrastructure being based in those countries.

2. No, I don't think 'only the US has people smart enough.' It has to do with culture and legal environment, and the US has been the world hub of innovation and entrepreneurship since the British Empire's decline post WWII. WWII itself wrecking so much of Europe played a part in that as well, of course.

More significantly, the fact that most of this stuff is owned in the US is why having US law forcing 'do business here, or do it in China,' is so crippling for China. Because they aren't going to choose China.

3. I hadn't been aware AMD was purchased by the UAE, so that's a fair point.

4. No, it has to do with culture and legal environment. There's a reason people like Elon Musk came to the US to do most of his innovation and business-building, there's a reason 'Silicon Valley' developed in the US, and not in Europe, even though in the 80's one or two places might have been able to rise as peer rivals.

A culture of freedom not just encourages innovation, it also rewards it more. The steadily-encroaching bureaucracy and cultural leftism has been gradually choking this in the US, but as much as has been lost here, the entire rest of the modern world is even worse, except maybe for Taiwan and SK, which is part of why they're the only others competing in such things, and why Japan used to, and isn't that far behind.
I don't know how to break it to you. But korea, taiwan, and europe are not part of the USA.

Biden only kicked out USA citizens from chinese factories. All other westerners, taiwanese, and koreans are still employeed there.

Even if you ignore intel's massive amount of chinese researchers and instead are racist and believe that chinese are stupid and can't make chips... they don't actually need to. Because they still have access to literally the entire western world, except the USA. This was a unilateral decision by biden alone, not a NATO decision binding all NATO nations.

You think I believe the Chinese are in serious trouble because I'm racist against Chinese?

...Why do I even talk with you if you're going to keep inventing shit in your own head? The problems China has with this stuff is because they're communists. Some of the most brilliant people in the world are Chinese, and a lot of those brilliant people have spent the last 3 decades finding ways to *get the hell out* from under the CCP's thumb, so they can live free. Some certainly still stay, but the problem is culture and government, not race.

Communism and the shitty cultural values it pushes forward are just about the exact opposite of what you want to encourage innovation and entrepreneurship. When China was loosening up through the 90's and 2000's, you saw the explosion in their economy in no small part because they became more free and less repressive. As Xi Jinping has headed straight back into totalitarianism, that's getting choked back out.

Also, Korea, Taiwan, and Japan, are *not* going to help China develop cutting-edge microchip production. They have zero incentive to do so, and with the US pulling out, nobody else has the ability to coerce them into it.

Some Europeans might, but that will not be enough on its own.


Also, that your mind jumped to 'he's saying this because he's racist' of all things, says a lot more about you, than it does about me.
 

DarthOne

☦️
United States Government Has Plans of Creating an AI that Can Expose Anonymous Writers



According to a recent announcement by the Office of the Director of National Intelligence (ODNI), the Intelligence Advanced Projects Activity (IARPA) is developing a program to unmask anonymous writers. IARPA will use AI to analyze anonymous writers’ style. According to Cindy Harper of Reclaim the Net, a writer’s style “is seen as potentially being as unique as a fingerprint.”

“Humans and machines produce vast amounts of text content every day. Text contains linguistic features that can reveal author identity,” IARPA stated.

If IARPA succeeds with its venture, it believes that the Human Interpretable Attribution of Text Using Underlying Structure (HIATUS) program could identify a writer’s style from multiple samples and change those patterns to increase the anonymization of the writing.

“We have a strong chance of meeting our goals, delivering much-needed capabilities to the Intelligence Community, and substantially expanding our understanding of variation in human language using the latest advances in computational linguistics and deep learning,” declared HIATUS program manager Dr. Timothy McKinnon.

On top of that, IARPA said it will create explainability standards for the program’s AIs.

ODNI revealed that HIATUS could have several applications, which includes fighting foreign influence activities, defending writers whose work may potentially endanger them, and identifying counterintelligence risks. Per McKinnon, the program can identify if a machine generated or a human being wrote the text.

However, Harper noted that “it is not IARPA’s work to turn HIATUS into something usable. The agency’s work is only to develop the technology.” Regardless, it’s becoming clear that the ruling class has it in for anonymous writers and those who use pen names.

Writing under a pen name is as American as apple pie. Many of the Founding Fathers wrote under pen names throughout the ratification of the United States Constitution. This is how many controversial writers can defend themselves from the state and private actors who want to do them harm.

Should the establishment have its way with regards to end anonymity, free speech in America will be one step closer to its deathbed.


Oh no.
 

Urabrask Revealed

Let them go.
Founder
Threadban 2c - Stop posting stuff nearly advocating violence. You have a history of this, it's nearly a TOS violation, so this is a general warning for all of your future posts on the site: Stop playing footsie with the line about violence.
I think we are getting close to the point where terrorism becomes not only necessary, but a moral imperative. You cannot negotiate with people that want to see you dead, your children broken into sex-slaves, and your ideals erased from history. Either they destroy you or you destroy them. There's very few other ways.
 

LordsFire

Internet Wizard
I think we are getting close to the point where terrorism becomes not only necessary, but a moral imperative. You cannot negotiate with people that want to see you dead, your children broken into sex-slaves, and your ideals erased from history. Either they destroy you or you destroy them. There's very few other ways.

No. Terrorism is not the answer. Terrorism is violence targeted specifically at causing terror in order to effect political or social change. There's also a bunch of socially-imbued emotion centered around the term.

If things get to the point where we've gone past the soap, ballot, and jury boxes, the use of the ammo box is not for terrorism, it's to throw down illegitimate pedophile-worshipping governments in a decisive move.
 

Batrix2070

RON/PLC was a wonderful country.
I think we are getting close to the point where terrorism becomes not only necessary, but a moral imperative. You cannot negotiate with people that want to see you dead, your children broken into sex-slaves, and your ideals erased from history. Either they destroy you or you destroy them. There's very few other ways.
No
No. Terrorism is not the answer. Terrorism is violence targeted specifically at causing terror in order to effect political or social change. There's also a bunch of socially-imbued emotion centered around the term.
If things get to the point where we've gone past the soap, ballot, and jury boxes, the use of the ammo box is not for terrorism, it's to throw down illegitimate pedophile-worshipping governments in a decisive move.
I agree, we don't need terrorists who's only goal is to justify even more surveillance of the public in the name of "security." What we need is Rokosz, that is, rebellion against the authorities who have overstepped their prerogatives and who need to be called to order militarily.
As we can see, peaceful demonstrations are being drowned out. It's time to make a decent noise.
Maybe a bunch of armed men standing under the windows of the ruling edifices should bring them back from fantasy to reality.
 

Yinko

Well-known member
United States Government Has Plans of Creating an AI that Can Expose Anonymous Writers






Oh no.
It'll take five minutes for someone to pump out a simple AI that makes this impossible. All you need is for a program to take your text and put it through a thesaurus, or run it back and forth through a google-translate a few times to wreck your word choice and syntax.
 

DarthOne

☦️
It'll take five minutes for someone to pump out a simple AI that makes this impossible. All you need is for a program to take your text and put it through a thesaurus, or run it back and forth through a google-translate a few times to wreck your word choice and syntax.
Maybe. I have a better idea. Don’t allow them to make such measures necessary in the first place.
 

Morphic Tide

Well-known member
Terrorism is violence targeted specifically at causing terror in order to effect political or social change.
Pretty sure it'd take like three well-placed riots to sent most of the Leftists right up their own asses in fear, and it's a good "opening move" for an outright civil war. Doing it to Pennsylvania's State Department seems the best target, if one were to insist on the Glowup, since they're actively forcing illegitimate elections, as affirmed by federal courts.

Would probably trigger a civil war anyways, but that's about as surgically targeted as you can get. Makes the point that the Deep State corruptocrats are not safe and that it is over already officially declared illegal behavior violating the integrity of the elections.
 

Yinko

Well-known member
Maybe. I have a better idea. Don’t allow them to make such measures necessary in the first place.
Sure, obviously that's the best solution. However, just like with VPN's and putting tape over your in-built web-cameras, people quickly adopt ways of life that block lazy government surveillance. Not to mention that all of this stuff about the government allowing themselves surveil anyone for any reason (or no reason at all), or find out who is writing what, it's not new, they are just trying to make what they are already doing legal.
 

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