Terthna
Professional Lurker
He may not have done it, but he certainly took advantage of it. Implementing the Patriot Acts, invading Afghanistan and Iraq; he did not let the opportunity presented to him go to waste.
Breaking News January 6th Stop the Steal Rally & Capitol Breaching/Storming
- Thread starter Duke Nukem
- Start date
How do you think we could have gotten Bin Laden? Let the group he controls run free after attacking us? We took out most of AQ and mot of the Taliban... we should have left yes but we had reason.
I never once said he wasn't a scumbag on top of being stupid.
Arch Dornan
Oh, lovely. They've sent me a mo-ron.
Slick Willy could've saved him the trouble after the first attack on the world trade center.
Terthna
Professional Lurker
Bin Laden and Al-Qaeda were just an excuse; the fact that we didn't leave afterwards is proof of that.
So....we didn't know where he was....we didn't have anything in place compared to now.....
So...we should have just let them off with killing nearly 3k Americans?
Terthna
Professional Lurker
I'm not saying that; I'm just saying that Bush used that to his advantage.
Duke Nukem
Hail to the king baby
He was right yet again about how the media would react.
Through CIA friends who knew Bin Laden from his Mujahadeen days?
Bin Laden cut ties by that point.
I have my doubts on that. One thing you have to understand is that Boomers and GenXers were very much brought up with the massive success of the post-WW2 nation building front and center. Remember, West Germany and Japan went from bombed out broken countries at the end of WW2 to first world nations with first world technology, infrastructure, and engagement with the world in barely twenty years. The Philippines were also seen as a major success of America being able to take a third world former Spanish colony and uplift it pretty successfully too. Sure, Vietnam was a bit of a sore spot, but we hadn't been engaged in Nation Building there, we'd lost a war for complex reasons.
As such, for Boomer politicians and GenXers the idea that the US could rebuild ANY NATION was actually a THING. They REALLY BELIEVED they could uplift Afghanistan from a third world Islamic tribal state to a modern representative democracy with a functioning society and culture. After all, the US had a great track record at the time of doing so, and with less technology and knowledge.
Of course, what was ignored was more than a few things. Both Japan and Germany had long, long traditions of Rule of Law and low civil and governmental corruption. They ignored the fact that before we rebuilt Germany and Japan we BROKE them with Total War. Something nobody really seemed to remember was that the US has not actually fought using Total War tactics SINCE World War 2, always fighting these strange wars where the politicians are setting the goals and holding the armed forces back. But that lack of Total War and the Total Domination and Breaking of the enemy's spirit it brings meant that we never had the same scope and capability to rebuild as we did with them. We also were unwilling to do the hard work of purging corruption out of concern for keeping out local allies in line, when what should have been done is any whiff of civil or governmental corruption should have been purged and if that caused a village to declare for the Taliban, that village should have been completely leveled with an airstrike. But the modern US and modern American civilians do not have the stomach for what it actually takes to reform a society as messed up as Afghanistan, and everyone realized that, and so took half measures, made things look good for the press, and hope that somehow going through the motions would eventually stick.
As the old saying goes, never attribute to malice which can be better attributed to stupidity.
You forgot Korea.
We used total war bombing tactics then. Level all of the north
Sobek
Disgusting Scalie
People really underestimate the facts of the matter. A conspiracy of the type needed to do 9/11 wouldn't concern itself with the whims of Bush or Cheney, such plots don't do well with people like that.
I am of the opinion that the spooks saw it coming and simply let it happen because it would be useful.
The funny thing is the only people who are gonna be fooled by this room temperature IQ take are people already so deep in the propaganda that they honestly think Qanon did Jan 6th.
I am of the opinion that the spooks saw it coming and simply let it happen because it would be useful.
The funny thing is the only people who are gonna be fooled by this room temperature IQ take are people already so deep in the propaganda that they honestly think Qanon did Jan 6th.
For those claiming Bush Jr. was stupid...you really don't know.
I've talked with those that have met him, and he's often one of the smartest people in the room.
The 'country boy' nukuler stuff was, apparently, carefully crafted in order to make him appear more 'everyman'.
I'm not a big fan of A LOT of what he ended up doing, but don't go making the mistake of thinking "W" was dumb or stupid.
I've talked with those that have met him, and he's often one of the smartest people in the room.
The 'country boy' nukuler stuff was, apparently, carefully crafted in order to make him appear more 'everyman'.
I'm not a big fan of A LOT of what he ended up doing, but don't go making the mistake of thinking "W" was dumb or stupid.
He's not dumb, not at all; he just has made some very dumb calls based on trusting certain people to much and letting his daddy issues drive us to invade Iraq.
One of his old college/university classmates is a good friend of mine, and said W got through Yale mostly by cheating. Which frankly, takes no small amount of cleverness, skill, and guile on it's own, to do it successfully, so W is no idiot.
No, we didn't.
Total War in Korea would have involved bombing not just North Korea, but all of mainland China once they got involved, probably until they glowed, as well as making bombing runs and an invasion of the Soviet Union, who were suppling the North Koreans with weapons, planes, and pilots.
Korea was the first war where politicians tied the hands of the military severely due to political considerations and not wanting to actually commit to fighting the war that was being fought. The minute that Chinese troops crossed into North Korea was the minute that bombers should have been overflying all of China... but were not due to not wanting to escalate the conflict by the politicians. There was no total war in Korea, there was a limited war that marked the first modern war the United States failed to win, instead reverting to status quo and then never actually ending the conflict.
I'm not saying he was stupid, I'm saying he, and the politicians in DC, have been unwilling to commit to the type of warfare necessary to win a war since the 1950s.
hyperspacewizard
Well-known member
It’s weird how similar they are dressed in that photo and they kind of look like they all came from a country club or something.
stephen the barbarian
Well-known member
they probably all work in the same precinct.