NATO Military News

[ATP]

Strona główna - NITROERG

nitroerg.pl

They probably do, and if not, any nitrochemical plants can fairly easily start doing so with wartime order if need be.
The question is, if no one does, how much would it cost, and would our ammo plants pay 2x as much for it being domestic?

That is why we do not have modern fighters in 1939.We thought,that we could made them,but it was impossible for us - and when we try to buy some,it was too late.
That is why general Waldemar Skwarczyński want production now.And he is right,becouse if we do not made it,we would lost again,like in 1939.
Well,old Putin friend Tusk would simply surrender,so ....
We need army anyway,as long as people want him as premier.

 

[Marduk]

That is why we do not have modern fighters in 1939.We thought,that we could made them,but it was impossible for us - and when we try to buy some,it was too late.

We did not have modern fighters, but we had a lot of domestic fighters, they just weren't modern, kinda ruining your point. but as i always complain, if we had domestic fighters now, they would not be modern either.

That is why general Waldemar Skwarczyński want production now.And he is right,becouse if we do not made it,we would lost again,like in 1939.
Well,old Putin friend Tusk would simply surrender,so ....
We need army anyway,as long as people want him as premier.

We are talking basic chemistry there, not some exotic electronics, we probably have chemical plants that can make it, and in peacetime no one wants to pay for one to just stand idle.

 

[ATP]

We did not have modern fighters, but we had a lot of domestic fighters, they just weren't modern, kinda ruining your point. but as i always complain, if we had domestic fighters now, they would not be modern either.

We are talking basic chemistry there, not some exotic electronics, we probably have chemical plants that can make it, and in peacetime no one wants to pay for one to just stand idle.

1.Turkey is building fighters now,just like Sweden.So could we.But i agree,that it is cheaper to buy.
2.Then why we do not produce it? mistake made by all ruling parties during last 20 years.

 

[Husky_Khan]

1.Turkey is building fighters now,just like Sweden.So could we.But i agree,that it is cheaper to buy.

Yes the TFI Kaan!!!

 

[Marduk]

1.Turkey is building fighters now,just like Sweden.So could we.But i agree,that it is cheaper to buy.

Do we have any data if they are worth it other than their advertising brochures?

Sweden was not in NATO and was making its own fighters since WW2, and they had money for it as they didn't get ruined in WW2, so they had an experience and industrial base. Still, it's not the cheap fighter some people believe it is, that was just misleading advertising, and for some reason they aren't getting into gen 5 fighter game, even they just don't have the money, while Americans are already working on gen 6.

We stopped doing fighters with Mig-17 which already was an import in nonsense commie economy, we would be starting from nothing and that's something even richer countries than us can't afford. If you look at Turkey's economics, they are the kind of country who does things it can't afford, and the effect is probably not impressive.
They are planning to finish it in 2030's, who knows when they do in fact finish, it might end up like with the Russian stealth fighter, by the time they make them they will be obsolete.

We had semi-modern helicopter production, but even that was sold off and no one would fund modernizing that, because it was a lot like Huey, but without the post cold war modernization programs, so it could not compete.

2.Then why we do not produce it? mistake made by all ruling parties during last 20 years.

Can we produce it with competitive price and quality and a customer?
If there is no 3 times yes, it's not business, it's socialism.

 

[ATP]

Do we have any data if they are worth it other than their advertising brochures?

Sweden was not in NATO and was making its own fighters since WW2, and they had money for it as they didn't get ruined in WW2, so they had an experience and industrial base. Still, it's not the cheap fighter some people believe it is, that was just misleading advertising, and for some reason they aren't getting into gen 5 fighter game, even they just don't have the money, while Americans are already working on gen 6.

We stopped doing fighters with Mig-17 which already was an import in nonsense commie economy, we would be starting from nothing and that's something even richer countries than us can't afford. If you look at Turkey's economics, they are the kind of country who does things it can't afford, and the effect is probably not impressive.
They are planning to finish it in 2030's, who knows when they do in fact finish, it might end up like with the Russian stealth fighter, by the time they make them they will be obsolete.

We had semi-modern helicopter production, but even that was sold off and no one would fund modernizing that, because it was a lot like Huey, but without the post cold war modernization programs, so it could not compete.

Here,i could agree.Making fighters now would be too costly for us.We should join Japan effort in creating 6th gen fighter instead.

Can we produce it with competitive price and quality and a customer?
If there is no 3 times yes, it's not business, it's socialism.

And during war you need ammo now,not when it would be profitable to made.Better socialism in few factories,then lost war.Najpierw być,potem jak być,as Lelewel once said.
/First live,then discuss how - my translation/

Besides,we are in IV Reich,and it is socialist arleady.Too late to complain.

P.S Merry Easter ! Jesus is King !

 

[Marduk]

Here,i could agree.Making fighters now would be too costly for us.We should join Japan effort in creating 6th gen fighter instead.

Japan has stupid laws about that so it's hard to arrange.

And during war you need ammo now,not when it would be profitable to made.Better socialism in few factories,then lost war.Najpierw być,potem jak być,as Lelewel once said.
/First live,then discuss how - my translation/

If we go bankrupt before war that is a problem.

Besides,we are in IV Reich,and it is socialist arleady.Too late to complain.

P.S Merry Easter ! Jesus is King !

IV Reich will laugh at us if we have factories for making chemicals that don't make chemicals because no one wants the chemicals now and we don't know if anyone will want them ever.

 

[ATP]

Japan has stupid laws about that so it's hard to arrange.

1.Japan arleady is cooperating on 6th gen fighter with Italy and England.We should just join fun.

If we go bankrupt before war that is a problem.

2-3 factories would not bancrupt us.When green madness would do so.

IV Reich will laugh at us if we have factories for making chemicals that don't make chemicals because no one wants the chemicals now and we don't know if anyone will want them ever.

No one wants? Ukraine wants million pf 155mm schells.And EU agreed to pay.We could made that,except working for our own army.

 

[Marduk]

1.Japan arleady is cooperating on 6th gen fighter with Italy and England.We should just join fun.

Do we have the money and technology for that?

2-3 factories would not bancrupt us.When green madness would do so.

The politics of keeping the money and not electing a government one time who will sell off the useless factory would be a menace here.

No one wants? Ukraine wants million pf 155mm schells.And EU agreed to pay.We could made that,except working for our own army.

And here you eat up the propaganda of anti western side that the West has no production capacity.

MSN

Make orders and put money behind them, there's plenty of capacity. Hell, more may get built.
The problem is that the orders are small, poorly paid, reserved for favored companies, or nonexistent at all.

 

[ATP]

Do we have the money and technology for that?

We have money for Fit for 55,just stop that madness and we would have more then enough.And technology would be Japan.

The politics of keeping the money and not electing a government one time who will sell off the useless factory would be a menace here.

Factories who let us defend ourselves are never useless.But you are right,american tv in Poland could elect german agent Tusk again.Or one of his minions.

And here you eat up the propaganda of anti western side that the West has no production capacity.

MSN

Make orders and put money behind them, there's plenty of capacity. Hell, more may get built.
The problem is that the orders are small, poorly paid, reserved for favored companies, or nonexistent at all.

Then we could produce that.It is no matter if West do not produce enough schells becouse it is impossible or becouse they are ruled by idiots - important thing is,THAT THEY DO NOT PRODUCE IT.
So,we could do that instead.

 

[Marduk]

We have money for Fit for 55,just stop that madness and we would have more then enough.And technology would be Japan.

No, we don't have the money for fit for 55, the EU has money for that and makes it the law for there to be money for it. If i was the dictator of EU i would shift 100% of bullshit green funds to defense for as long as Russia doesn't demilitarize and tell everyone who complains to go pester Russia about it, but unfortunately i'm not.

Factories who let us defend ourselves are never useless.But you are right,american tv in Poland could elect german agent Tusk again.Or one of his minions.

No, factories for exotic scenarios where we defend ourselves but for mysterious reasons all allies also refuse to sell us basic chemicals. That is useless because it is unrealistic.

Then we could produce that.It is no matter if West do not produce enough schells becouse it is impossible or becouse they are ruled by idiots - important thing is,THAT THEY DO NOT PRODUCE IT.
So,we could do that instead.

Yes, we could do that, but where do we get money for that? If there are orders and money, other problems are solvable easily, the problem is that there aren't.

 

[ATP]

No, we don't have the money for fit for 55, the EU has money for that and makes it the law for there to be money for it. If i was the dictator of EU i would shift 100% of bullshit green funds to defense for as long as Russia doesn't demilitarize and tell everyone who complains to go pester Russia about it, but unfortunately i'm not.

They have OUR moneys.

No, factories for exotic scenarios where we defend ourselves but for mysterious reasons all allies also refuse to sell us basic chemicals. That is useless because it is unrealistic.

Our allies just supported german agent Tusk in taking power.What stop demorats from giving us to Moscov for notching again,like in 1945?

Yes, we could do that, but where do we get money for that? If there are orders and money, other problems are solvable easily, the problem is that there aren't.

From EU,they want schells for UKraine,right?

 

[Marduk]

They have OUR moneys.

Mostly German's not ours, and unlike us, the Germans actually vote for this shit, they even got greens in their government.

Our allies just supported german agent Tusk in taking power.What stop demorats from giving us to Moscov for notching again,like in 1945?

They stopped Germans from doing that with Ukraine.

From EU,they want schells for UKraine,right?

But not just any shells, they were picky about who and how produces them, with what components and other red tape.
Meanwhile Czechs said fuck it and sourced nearly a million with just some financial help, but without being so picky.

Czechs raise funds to buy 800,000 artillery shells for Ukraine

President Petr Pavel says the desperately needed ammo should be in Ukraine within weeks.

www.politico.eu

Insert mandatory joke about how EU bureaucrats organize things...

 

[Poe]

Why is it large numbers of the threads here devolve into pages, and pages, of ATP and Marduk mass replying to one another. Just ignore each other this is basically spam at this point

 

[ATP]

Mostly German's not ours, and unlike us, the Germans actually vote for this shit, they even got greens in their government.

Which mean ours,they still need pay for WW2

They stopped Germans from doing that with Ukraine.

For now,what stop them from giving us again?

But not just any shells, they were picky about who and how produces them, with what components and other red tape.
Meanwhile Czechs said fuck it and sourced nearly a million with just some financial help, but without being so picky.

Czechs raise funds to buy 800,000 artillery shells for Ukraine

President Petr Pavel says the desperately needed ammo should be in Ukraine within weeks.

www.politico.eu

Insert mandatory joke about how EU bureaucrats organize things...

Well,you are wrong again,but....

Why is it large numbers of the threads here devolve into pages, and pages, of ATP and Marduk mass replying to one another. Just ignore each other this is basically spam at this point

I would not reply about this topic anymore.

 

[Husky_Khan]

Patriot Missile Manufacturers prepare to ramp up production despite lack of orders.

How companies plan to ramp up production of Patriot missiles

As the demand for PAC-3 missiles rise amid conflicts in Ukraine and the Middle East, industry contends with how to ramp up quickly.

www.defensenews.com

How Patriot proved itself in Ukraine and secured a fresh future

What might have looked like an aging system not long ago now appears to be a workhorse that could be used for years to come.

www.defensenews.com

Apparently Lockheed can currently manufacture an entire battery of Patriot Missile Launchers in one month, but current backfill orders and foreign orders are significantly below that capacity.

Also Lockheed is increasing PAC-3 Missile production from the current 500 per year to 650 by 2027 despite concurrent lack of demand. They're also increasing manufacture of PAC-2 missiles from 240 per year to 420 per year. Patriot Missiles are also being manufactured in Germany and by Mitsubishi in Japan.

 

[Jormungandr]

Patriot Missile Manufacturers prepare to ramp up production despite lack of orders.

How companies plan to ramp up production of Patriot missiles

As the demand for PAC-3 missiles rise amid conflicts in Ukraine and the Middle East, industry contends with how to ramp up quickly.

www.defensenews.com

How Patriot proved itself in Ukraine and secured a fresh future

What might have looked like an aging system not long ago now appears to be a workhorse that could be used for years to come.

www.defensenews.com

Apparently Lockheed can currently manufacture an entire battery of Patriot Missile Launchers in one month, but current backfill orders and foreign orders are significantly below that capacity.

Also Lockheed is increasing PAC-3 Missile production from the current 500 per year to 650 by 2027 despite concurrent lack of demand. They're also increasing manufacture of PAC-2 missiles from 240 per year to 420 per year. Patriot Missiles are also being manufactured in Germany and by Mitsubishi in Japan.

Well, Ukraine did demonstrate the product's viability versus weapons such as Russia's, ah, "super missiles", haha.

With Russia being a bunch of dickbags, China getting more brazen with their new yet aging hardware, and Iran starting to piss off countries across the world by supporting Water Rat Piracy, Lockheed are probably sensing a business opportunity in addition to keeping up required stockpiles for US and NATO military use. shrug

 

[strunkenwhite]

"If you build it, they will come."

 

[ATP]

Late news,but during last polish visit in Washington our president and premier meet Biden - when Orban do not tried it,instead meet with Trump.
Why we must be lead by idiots,not normal politician,like Orban?

Our president was warned to not meet with Trump - and eunuch obeyed....

 

[ATP]

Polish patriot,Kazimierz Czarniecki - during WW2 was polish nationalist in Tarnopol,after WW2 tried to survive.He worked as teacher in Glubczyce - boys asked him for help in self-teaching.
Becouse they were making leaflets,commies catched them.
They do not have weapons,but one had sling - so,they become terrorist group.
And he become leader of terrorists,and get death penalty.
Commies turned it into 15 years,but murdered him anyway there.Probably jews - they liked to murder polish patriots,when for our common bandits it was just job.

Dude could become real terrorist as well.
What we could learn from that? when leftist take power,either do notching,or go and kill them.Leaflets are for elections,not fighting genociders.