The Vader comics were good. Besides some dodgey artwork in Star Wars the main series, they are pretty good.
The bounty hunters is fun to watch all the various ones arrive.
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The bounty hunters is fun to watch all the various ones arrive.
Have you forgotten the infamous Vader stalker nurse comic yet?
EU had the best Vader comics, the Disney stuff is as good as mouse droppings.
Some of the best Vader EU comics.
-Darth Vader and the Ghost Prison
-Darth Vader and the Lost Command
-Darth Vader and the Cry of Shadows
In Disney we have annoying ass Dr Aphra, the aforementioned stalker nurse, and the cringy teen edgelord Darth Momen.
There is no comparison here, just no comparison.
If you say otherwise, then may you burn forever amid the lava of Mustafar.
Eh, those are not the best of Vader, and are short.Have you forgotten the infamous Vader stalker nurse comic yet?
EU had the best Vader comics, the Disney stuff is as good as mouse droppings.
Some of the best Vader EU comics.
-Darth Vader and the Ghost Prison
-Darth Vader and the Lost Command
-Darth Vader and the Cry of Shadows
In Disney we have annoying ass Dr Aphra, the aforementioned stalker nurse, and the cringy teen edgelord Darth Momen.
There is no comparison here, just no comparison.
If you say otherwise, then may you burn forever amid the lava of Mustafar.
I like how you pick out an okay series, a single Arc from the Vader comics, and a single story from the Vader stories.
Wow, so cool.
The stalker nurse I loved because he kills her in the end.. which is what she deserved.
Jaenera Targaryen
Well-known member
I prefer Legacy, and Tales of the Jedi.
Legacy was epic. And Cade Skywalker went from annoying edgelord to an actually decent person by the end of the series.
That's character development.
Jaenera Targaryen
Well-known member
Luke - in Force Ghost form no less - even gave one hell of a speech to Cade that he could also throw against his canon counterpart.
DarthOne
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Ehhhhhh.The x-wing series was fantastic. How dare you.
Did it have it's good points? Sure. Were the main characters generally likable? Sure.
Did said main characters come across as a bunch of special forces/James Bond secret-agents instead of just elite fighter pilots? Did it further the myth that the Empire's military machines largely were junk, like some sort of World War II movie with the TIE's standing in for the Japanese Zero?
YES.
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Lord Sovereign
The resident Britbong
That's also a horrible misunderstanding of the A6M Zero on the part of the writers. For the first few years of the Pacific War, it had no rival in the air and remained a very real danger to American planes even when allied aircraft development started outstripping the Japanese.
The Zero was mass produced because it was good as well as cost effective. Same sort of goes for the good old Messerschmidt BF109.
DarthOne
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No argument here. It's 'Sherman Tank syndrome' all over again. By which I refer to the exaggerated myth of how the Sherman tank (also of WW2) was a thinly armored, under-gunned, and combustible death trap. One that was easy prey for the German Tiger and Panther tanks.
Lord Sovereign
The resident Britbong
Oh god, tell me about it. The Sherman was a reliable little work horse that could pack a punch and be mass produced. Then you got the fireflies that could pop off the heavier German tanks with their 76mm guns.
That is, mind you, if the German tanks actually show up instead of breaking down halfway to the battlefield.
Look, I do like the German tanks of the time. When they worked, they were cracking pieces of machinery.
DarthOne
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Something that is often overlooked about the German tanks is that, by that point in the war, they basically were having to be rushed around like crazy with too little maintenance being done on them. The wear and tear wasn't helped by the Allies cheerfully blowing up railways that would be used to transport them or repair parts.
...anyway, I think that's enough WW2 talk for this thread. Better put a stop before the Mods Get Upset.
That's exactly why I loved those books as a kid but find them deeply immature and shallow as an adult. Rogue Squadron, the act-of-plot Hero Protagonists who are invincibly elite hyper-ace pilots and also invincibly elite supercommandos and also perfect detectives who can figure out any Imperial plot and also perfectly skilled infiltrators, but are also playful and likeable everyday dudes, when they're not being perfect at everything.
Oh yeah, and then one of them is also the best Jedi ever.
DarthOne
☦️
Agreed. Personally, if I was to be put in charge of making some sort of EU/Legends style rewrite, I’d have them only be true in broad strokes, if not some sort of in-universe ham-fisted New Republic propaganda or series ‘inspired by true events’.
Needless to say the ‘real’ members of Rogue Squadron are not fans.
The whole "TIEs are suicide cannon fodder" meme is entirely the product of EU wank-stories. When you look at the actual movies, TIEs are presented as a deadly threat. The exchange rate onscreen in A New Hope is two TIEs for one X-Wing in the battle above the Death Star. The trench run, of course, has Vader absolutely reaping, killing three Y-Wings and four X-Wings before being ambushed by the Falcon, while one of his wingmen scores one additional X-Wing.
But there were thirty Rebel fighters that attacked the Death Star -- the Special Edition approach shot shows most of them explicitly onscreen -- and only three made it home, which implies that the four remaining TIEs killed almost every single remaining X-Wing and Y-Wing while the camera focused on the trench runs. Luke and Wedge were the two X-Wings that got away, so we know the *only* survivor of the general melee was that *one* Y-Wing; every single X-Wing not involved in the trench run died.
This is actually consistent with the fact that we never actually see an X-Wing outmaneuver a TIE Fighter. Every time we see them engage each other, the TIE easily gets on the X-Wing's tail and stays there. Both on-screen TIE shootdowns involve a named elite Rebel managing to evade the TIE's fire until another named elite Rebel is able to swing by and shoot it off of him, but this cooperation is entirely ad-hoc; the concepts of assigned wingmen, covering, and formation maneuvering are apparently alien to the Rebels.
Edit: Luke offers to "cover" Red Leader, but only after it's too late to matter, which is why Red Leader tells him to stay there and get set up for a attack run. What the Rebels *should* have done, of course, was have X-Wings specifically preassigned to top cover for the Y-Wings in the trench, which would have at least made it *much harder* for Vader to shoot them down.
But there were thirty Rebel fighters that attacked the Death Star -- the Special Edition approach shot shows most of them explicitly onscreen -- and only three made it home, which implies that the four remaining TIEs killed almost every single remaining X-Wing and Y-Wing while the camera focused on the trench runs. Luke and Wedge were the two X-Wings that got away, so we know the *only* survivor of the general melee was that *one* Y-Wing; every single X-Wing not involved in the trench run died.
This is actually consistent with the fact that we never actually see an X-Wing outmaneuver a TIE Fighter. Every time we see them engage each other, the TIE easily gets on the X-Wing's tail and stays there. Both on-screen TIE shootdowns involve a named elite Rebel managing to evade the TIE's fire until another named elite Rebel is able to swing by and shoot it off of him, but this cooperation is entirely ad-hoc; the concepts of assigned wingmen, covering, and formation maneuvering are apparently alien to the Rebels.
Edit: Luke offers to "cover" Red Leader, but only after it's too late to matter, which is why Red Leader tells him to stay there and get set up for a attack run. What the Rebels *should* have done, of course, was have X-Wings specifically preassigned to top cover for the Y-Wings in the trench, which would have at least made it *much harder* for Vader to shoot them down.
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LindyAF
Well-known member
IMO this should be done with almost all of the EU and much of the Disney stuff.
With a franchise as large as Star Wars, the most practical thing to do is simply make it so that the standard for any work isn't "this happened" but rather "someone is saying this, but they may be wrong and/or lying."
This would also go a long way to explain why Star Wars history stretches so far back without ever really seeming to change, which is what throws me the most with the TOR / KOTOR stuff.
And there are more TIE fighters beyond the stock TIE fighter.
Like the TIE Interceptor, TIE Bomber, TIE Defender.
but if you ask me I'll always go with a remote controlled squadron of Droid Tri-fighters or a squadron of Z-95 Headhunters.
What it really comes down to is that the performance of fighter-scale shields in ANH goes *completely* against what is portrayed in the EU; the EU conception is pretty much drawn from the X-Wing computer games, where shields were *massively* buffed because the Rebels were player characters and the Imperials weren't.
That is something the Squadrons game gets pretty good, balance and all but tie fire faster and more menurverable, and X wings stronger, hit harder, and have shields
I would say Squadrons ends up kinda midway between movie-performance and X-Wing series performance, because Squadrons is *very* much a modern reboot of the X-Wing series. The big change in Squadrons is that TIEs get the hull repair feature, which goes an *enormous* way towards levelling things versus hyped-up Rebel shields. In the old model, all damage to a TIE was permanent, whereas shield damage to a Rebel fighter could be quickly regenerated.
Note that even in Squadrons TIE guns are faster-firing than X-Wing guns, but only the Interceptor actually has rapid-fire model guns, which is backwards to what we see in the movies.
If they were true to the movies, the TIE Fighter would have two rapid-fire light cannons with auto-tracking and a short burst of 4-6 shots from those guns would shred an X-Wing, shield and all. The X-Wing would have four slow-firing but very hard-hitting heavy cannons where a single hit would cripple a TIE and two hits would outright vaporize it, but overall they are poorly selected weapons for fighter-to-fighter combat and really only show their strength when X-Wings are attacking bigger ships and can cause SERIOUS hull damage with strafing runs. The TIE Interceptor would be intermediate, with four medium impact, medium rate of fire cannons coupled to extreme maneuverability. The A-Wing would be as fast and maneuverable as the Interceptor while carrying two rapid-fire, auto-tracking guns with a *frighteningly* wide field of fire; shields make it a little less vulnerable than TIEs, and overall it is the most lethal dogfighter in the GFFA.