Star Wars Star Wars Discussion Thread - LET THE PAST D-! Oh, wait, nevermind

WyldCard4

Well-known member
Basically, no one we see is representative of the galactic norm.

And yet a lot of the time the community treats them like they are. Han is, even before he meets Obi-Wan and Luke, considered one of the best smugglers in the galaxy. His rolodex is a whose who of the galaxies criminal element and organizations. He was personally smuggling spice for Jabba by the ship load. Jabba the Hutt, one of the five or so most powerful crime lords in the galaxy, was *personally* hiring Han for jobs.

So yes, Han can show up on a planet and be meeting face to face with the biggest criminals on the planet in a few hours or days. Not just because he knows who to talk to but because everyone who is anyone in the underworld knows who he is and his skills are both useful and proven. The mere fact that Han Solo came to that person for something is a massive reputation boost to them. The favors game? Well Han can provide an introduction to basically anyone who is anyone in the underworld.

Honestly I feel Han being a big shot is really a fuck up on the part of writers who misunderstood the character as presented in A New Hope.

This is a guy who was clearly blowing smoke out of his ass when he talked about doing the Kessle Run in "parsecs" to impress random yokel Luke Skywalker and an old dude from the desert to get paid roughly in the zone of the price of a random kid's space-truck or, being very generous to fanon, maybe the price of his "farm" of a few humidity traps selling water to the port. And there's no indications they even could have used the farm, much less did right after the Imperials shot the place up, or had any access to significant credit.

Han Solo was a space truck driver or real world merchant ship captain tier dude who talked a big game to a naive kid who had not gone to space college. Several sets of writers were taken in by his stitch and decided "oh wow, he and his crew are totally cool put together spacemen!"

Any trip where the price of what, a luxury car being pretty generous, is worth it to the guy to fly the entire ship, counting all the fixed costs of space craft ownership, on a journey lasting several days, is really suggesting he's scrapping by and really freaking cash poor even if I'd say he's still in the galactic one percent the idea that Luke could pay him without being mega-rich himself kind of makes all the "Han was the absolute top tier of criminals at the time" pretty ridiculous IMO.

Note this is not an argument against Han having a really cool back story, just an argument against him and associated characters being portrayed as the best and most famous criminals in the galaxy. I think that misses a lot of the aesthetics of Star Wars as a space western and Used Future to portray Han and, honestly, Jabba as these galactic tier bigshots instead of a random scoundrel and a crazy dude squatting in a castle running drugs.

This runs against a lot of media, but really, if we're saying we can't discount big elements of Star Wars media as stupid, what are we even doing?
 

Emperor Tippy

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It is something of a chicken or the egg thing.

When the OT first occurred, Han being some relatively random space trucker worked because none of the universe was fleshed out at all.

But taking into account everything else?

Jabba the Hutt was a seriously top tier criminal. Hell, he was personally favor trading with Palpatine back before he ever became Supreme Chancellor.

So Han being directed employed by him as a drug smuggler? With a cargo large enough for Jabba to personally care enough to put serious money on his head? That wasn't a small shipment.

And drug cartels don't hire randos to move wholesale drug shipments.

Suddenly the entire presentation of Han and the Millenium Falcon changes. Rando Trucker is transformed into major underworld figure.

Or take the interaction with Obi-Wan. At the time of the OT, he was basically a rando space wizard. But then we get the prequels and we learn that he was at one point literally one of the highest ranking military officers in the galaxy, dealt with politics at the highest of all possible levels, and was a member of the Jedi High Council on merit. Hiring Han becomes, suddenly, a lot less of a coincidence.
 

WyldCard4

Well-known member
So my interest here comes from working on an SI fic where the SI is dropped into the position, though not the body, of Darth Plagueis. And I want to be clear my version of Star Wars for that fic is actually taking the current discussion very seriously for what kind of setting the SI was dealing with.

So my SI pitch, as this is a nice active Star Wars thread. I'm using this jumpchain to build my SI. Also relevantly he took a supplement jump to try and blunt the impact of the Dark Side. This... didn't work too well and he got three years into his adventure before being assassinated and kicked back to Earth in a total failure that still left him ridiculously well off compared to his old life.

Now a half-crazy Sith with some Jedi teachings is stuck on Earth with his twin Twi'lek slave apprentices he bought as companions, a ton of Star Wars tech data he was preparing for his next jump anyway, an unarmed yacht star ship, and way more power for less of a price than most Sith could dream of due to jumpchain being a bit overly generous.

I am particularly curious on thoughts for what Star Wars tech diffusion would be doing, as that is one of the really interesting parts of the fic to me. Also the explosion of a barely-restrained Sith trying to manage in the real world and not go full Dark Lord despite honestly a lot of reason to.

If Han isn't all that, then why are the very top tier Bounty Hunters going after him?
What @Bear Ribs said, mostly. Han's whole debt to Jabba was within an order of magnitude of "random kid's sports car" at the high end.

Jabba was, giving most credit to the idea this was intended to be a high tier transaction, just more concerned with using up Han's reputation for his own gain in "do not mess with me." I think there's no way to watch A New Hope and come away with the EU or even Disney canon of Han being a major player instead of a marginal operator.

I can buy Han having a reputation, but problem is when we start seeing it as a galactic scale reputation outside of very specific criminal circles that I think the inconsistencies get really bad.
It is something of a chicken or the egg thing.

When the OT first occurred, Han being some relatively random space trucker worked because none of the universe was fleshed out at all.

But taking into account everything else?

Jabba the Hutt was a seriously top tier criminal. Hell, he was personally favor trading with Palpatine back before he ever became Supreme Chancellor.

I feel that's also a bit of point missing, though a lot less egregious than with Han. For example, going by Disney canon the guy in charge of Ryloth's occupation (not the figurehead, the real deal working for her) had no clue who Jabba was when the name was dropped, for example. This was the chief guy in charge of the Imperial occupation producing a key part of the drug trade Jabba was involved in and handling the detail work of the occupation, and Jabba didn't have him in his pocket and nobody even felt a need to tell him about Jabba for either "look away from his dealings" or "lookout for his dudes."

My primary point is that Star Wars outside of the films is really, really inconsistent, but I also think it's important because any "well, obviously it works that way" is the result of very liberal creative interpretation that can easily fold a different way. There's no consistent Watsonian logic behind the curtain here, as nice as it is to pretend there is. Thrawn Trilogy is not the movies is not EU The Clone Wars even before Disney retcons. We can maybe discuss Tippy's version as "averaged out novel EU" or something, but the statements really are not universal to all takes and it's not bad to have very different perspectives on what parts of Star Wars serve as the ones that inspire you.
 

Skallagrim

Well-known member
Vader was only after Luke. Han was in the way then.

There was already a HUGE bounty on Han at that point.
Well, Han was the guy who shot Vader's TIE just before Vader could take out that pesky X-Wing that ended up destroying the Death Star.

That sort of thing would presumably put you on the 'most wanted' list.

I think that if any other Imperial had been in charge, capturing Han would have been almost as good as capturing Luke himself, and no trap would have been set up. But Vader specifically cared about Luke, and didn't give a shit about Han. Vader is exactly the kind of guy who would consider the nr. 2 on the most wanted list to be unimportant, because nr. 1 is his own Force-sensitive son.

So we might assume Vader was being pretty a-typical in just casually handing Han over to Fett (and ultimately, Jabba).



Regarding Han's character in general, I think this definitely evolved as the story developed. In ANH, Han was supposed to be a guy who's all talk, but who is basically just a street-level tough guy with some smarts about him. He's the tough guy who grows to be noble, while Luke is the wet-behind-the-ears kid who grows to be a knight.

That being said: the implicit retcons aren't actually contradicting anything. If Han is a bigshot, how do they pay him? Well, Obi-Wan is pretending to be a hermit, but he's actually a Jedi Master in exile. He had the Mystical Weapon of Destiny hidden in his home, it's not a stretch to infer that he also had a stash of gold/credits/whatever "for when it is needed". And Han being down in the dumps, in a seedy cantina, doesn't imply he's a low-level guy. He's explicitly in debt with Jabba the Hutt, and the debt appears to be big. Which implies that he was doing major jobs for Jabba, but something went wrong-- which is why he's in deep shit now.

I like the old EU's Han Solo trilogy, which explores his backstory in a way that feels true to the character.

My main problem with 'Han Solo fanon' is that so many people seem to assume that he is this suave, womanising bad boy that he -- VERY EVIDENTLY -- only pretends to be. Han Solo is an awkward guy who puts up a mask of being 'cool', but it's clearly fake. In fact, once we meet Lando, it's pretty obvious that Han Solo's whole act is "trying to come across like Lando". Which is hilarious.
 

Emperor Tippy

Merchant of Death
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I am particularly curious on thoughts for what Star Wars tech diffusion would be doing, as that is one of the really interesting parts of the fic to me. Also the explosion of a barely-restrained Sith trying to manage in the real world and not go full Dark Lord despite honestly a lot of reason to.

It wouldn't be. The Star Wars tech base is reliant on resources and infrastructure that simply don't exist on or around Earth.

I mean Repulsors? The critical component of those is harvested from around black holes.

Imagine taking your smartphone back to, say, 1990 and trying to recreate it. Let's assume that you have the full technical data package for its production. You are looking at, literally, more than ten billion (in 1990's dollars) just in direct infrastructure investment before you can even start looking at manufacturing that smart phone; and that assumes you have all the plans for everything involved in going from 1990 tech to 2020 tech.

Star Wars is thousands of years ahead of Earth tech wise, draws on galactic scale infrastructure, and a galaxies worth of resources.

And that all assumes that the laws of physics are the same.

Even if you brought a purpose built uplift droid designed to be able to study a civilizations technology, knowledge, and infrastructure and figure out how to best upgrade them to galactic standards you are still likely looking at centuries of work to get anywhere near actual SW tech.
 

Flintsteel

Sleeping Bolo
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That someone owns their own hyper capable star ship? That already makes them, objectively, one of the wealthiest people in the galaxy.
I'm gonna have to debate that point. Hyper-capable ships are very common in SW - to the point that there are sleezy second-hand starship dealers. That does not seem to be something that would exist if owning a starship meant someone was of the wealthy class.

It seems more likely that pleasure ships are rare, but working ships aren't. Sort of like the difference between luxury super cars and tractor trailers - they're in the same price range, but one is a pure luxury and the other actually works to pay for itself. So while a lot of people could own a working ship, most people don't want to live the space-nomad life and so don't bother.
 

Skallagrim

Well-known member
I've been thinking about an underlying problem with the sequel trilogy that I haven't thought that much about: it was very much rushed. Ideas never got time to settle properly, and I'm beginning to think that msy have been a major contributing factor to a lot of the issues of these films.

Sure, people have repeatedly noted that Disney was really setting itself up for "SW over-load" what with the one-off films released in the "off years" between major trilogy releases... but the fact that there was only one off-year between each film strikes me as relevant in itself.

Lucas always said that it takes a decade to produce a trilogy like this-- and it checks out. Lucas really put pen to paper for the OT in 1973, and the final film was released in 1983. And he put pen to paper for TPM in late 1994, with RotS ultimately being released in 2005. So, yeah... about a decade.

And every time, a gap of two "off-years" between all films. Because that's the production time you really need.

Disney bought Lucasfilm in late 2012. If we count the outlines Lucas had already drafted as useful prep work, then we're still talking about an overall schedule spanning 2012-2022. With the three films being released in 2016, 2019, and 2022.

Obviously, that would have led to a major issue in that Carrie Fisher would only be alive for one of these films. So it's not some cure-all. But still: Disney rushed the sequels quite horribly, and I think that was always a major problem, right from the start. Michael Arndt said he needed an extra year to get the script finalised properly, and Disney's response was to fire him. In retrospect, it might have been a smarter choice to give him that extra year.
 
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Earl

Well-known member
I've been thinking about an underlying problem with the sequel trilogy that I haven't thought that much about: it was very much rushed. Ideas never got time to settle properly, and I'm beginning to think that msy have been a major contributing factor to a lot of the issues of these films.

Sure, people have repeatedly noted that Disney was really setting itself up for "SW over-load" what with the one-off films released in the "off years" between major trilogy releases... but the fact that there was only one off-year between each film strikes me as relevant in itself.

Lucas always said that it takes a decade to produce a trilogy like this-- and it checks out. Lucas really put pen to paper for the OT in 1973, and the final film was released in 1983. And he put pen to paper for TPM in late 1994, with RotS ultimately being released in 2005. So, yeah... about a decade.

And every time, a gap of two "off-years" between all films. Because that's the production time you really need.

Disney bought Lucasfilm in late 2012. If we count the outlines Lucas had already drafted as useful prep work, then we're still talking about an overall schedule spanning 2012-2022. With the three films being released in 2016, 2019, and 2022.

Obviously, that would have led to a major issue in that Carrie Fisher would only be alive for one of these films. So it's not some cure-all. But still: Disney rushed the sequels quite horribly, and I think that was always a major problem, right from the start. Michael Arndt said he needed an extra year to get the script finalised properly, and Disney's response was to fire him. In retrospect, it might have been a smarter choice to give him that extra year.
They got blinded by the MCU and didnt realize that only worked because of Unique talent in Kevin Feigie and a wealth of background material to pull from.Star Wars, as a epic trilogy could not of worked that way. Now, maybe if they had thrown out Rogue one quality style spinoffs every year, and give the trilogy the time it needs. But unfortunately no.
 
Obviously, that would have led to a major issue in that Carrie Fisher would only be alive for one of these films. So it's not some cure-all. But still: Disney rushed the sequels quite horribly, and I think that was always a major problem, right from the start. Michael Arndt said he needed an extra year to get the script finalised properly, and Disney's response was to fire him. In retrospect, it might have been a smarter choice to give him that extra year.

Honestly, Carrie Fisher's death shows in hindsight that a reunion trilogy was about 15 years too late. By the time Disney bought Star Wars, Carrie was already suffering some major physical and mental health problems and Harrison Ford had long lost interest in returning back to the character. Granted Mark Hamill and Billie Dee Williams were still open to reprising their roles and being in good enough shape to do so, you could have done more movies with them, but yeah even if Disney had put the best foot forward possible and gotten the best Star Wars writers possible a "reunion trilogy" was always going to be a letdown. Maybe not as bad as the ST we got, but still a letdown.

Probably the greatest tragedy of all was that the success of Rouge One showed that a couple of Spin-off reunion films like "Shadows of the Empire" or "Truce at Bakara" could have been commercially successful and could have worked as appetizers while people waited for the Prequal trilogy.
 
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Skallagrim

Well-known member
Honestly, Carrie Fisher's death shows in hindsight that a reunion trilogy was about 15 years too late. By the time Disney bought Star Wars, Carrie was already suffering some major physical and mental health problems and Harrison Ford had long lost interest in returning back to the character. Granted Mark Hamill and Billie Dee Williams were still open to reprising their roles and being in good enough shape to do so, you could have done more movies with them, but yeah even if Disney had put the best foot forward possible and gotten the best Star Wars writers possible a "reunion trilogy" was always going to be a letdown. Maybe not as bad as the ST we got, but still a let down.

Probably the greatest tragedy of all was that the success of Rouge One showed that a couple of Spin-off reunion films like "Shadows of the Empire" or "Truce at Bakara" would have been commercially successful and could have worked as appetizers while people waited for the Prequal trilogy.
When he was making the OT (and still expecting to make sequels down the line), Lucas explicitly said he wanted to make them "around 2000". So you're spot-on with "15 years too late".

I do believe that after the OT, he first had little taste for more SW, and when he regained interest (we can pin it down to the year: 1989), he was pretty set on doing Prequels first. (His decision to allow post-RotJ EU stuff to be created was because he committed to making prequels and abandoning the notion of sequels at that point. This led to Heir of the Empire and Dark Empire both being released two years later.)

If we want Lucas to make sequels first, we're basically nixing the whole EU as we know it.

An alternative would be that Lucas decides to make the Prequels in '89, and then really commits to it. No dithering around with "special editions". He gets to writing in '89, and Episode I is released in '93. Episode II follows in in '96, and Episode III in '99. That gives you the same decade-long production cycle. It also gives you different prequels. Presumably, a CGI-fest wouldn't be feasible, and if he asks at the start of the nineties instead of the close of that decade, Lucas may well get a "yes" from Spielberg, Howard and Cameron when he asks them to direct the films.

Which could in turn quite plausibly lead to better-received Prequels. And then Lucas would be more positive to the making of more SW at an earlier stage. Writing for the sequels could then start in 2005, and the films could be released in 2009, 2012 and 2015. Still later than Lucas had planned back in the day, but meaningfully earlier than it actually ended up happening. (Carrie Fisher's health was visibly worse in TLJ than in TFA, so if we end the trilogy in 2015, I don't think it would be an issue.)

Would've been nice, if it had played out like that...
 
An alternative would be that Lucas decides to make the Prequels in '89, and then really commits to it. No dithering around with "special editions". He gets to writing in '89, and Episode I is released in '93. Episode II follows in in '96, and Episode III in '99. That gives you the same decade-long production cycle. It also gives you different prequels. Presumably, a CGI-fest wouldn't be feasible, and if he asks at the start of the nineties instead of the close of that decade, Lucas may well get a "yes" from Spielberg, Howard and Cameron when he asks them to direct the films.

Which could in turn quite plausibly lead to better-received sequels. And then Lucas would be more positive to the making of more SW at an earlier stage. Writing for the sequels could then start in 2005, and the films could be released in 2009, 2012 and 2015. Still later than Lucas had planned back in the day, but meaningfully earlier than it actually ended up happening. (Carrie Fisher's health was visibly worse in TLJ than in TFA, so if we end the trilogy in 2015, I don't think it would be an issue.)

Would've been nice, if it had played out like that...

As good as some of the Post endor stories were. Losing that section of the EU in exchange for a possibly better PT and a good solid ST would have been worth the trade-off as not only would it have gotten everyone that reunion sequel trilogy people wanted, but it could have done a more solid passing of the torch, which meant more movies in the future focused on a younger healthier cast that doesn't feel forced. Plus, you could still have your stories that take place in the ancient past (Like Knights of the old Republic which actually started in like the early 90s via comics) and stories that took place in the far far future.

Heck maybe Lucas wouldn't have felt the need to sell it to Disney by that point and even if he had, it would have been at a later point when all the original characters' stories were long told and set in stone meaning at worst the Disney films would have been just a set of bad films that could be moved on from much easier and best case scenario, with Disney not being able to bank on easy nostalgia it would have forced them to plan a trilogy out and maybe make something that is actually good.
 
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Emperor Tippy

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What Disney should have done was a straight remake of the OT with a new cast and modern CGI.

It would have made at least as much money, they had a great excuse to do so, and it would have given them a much younger cast to work with over the next twenty years.

Then, at the same time you are dealing with that, you use Disney Plus to release multiple TV shows set around the OT time period. Basically ten years before to, say, twenty years after.

Use a collection of relatively new and unknown actors and lock them into TV contracts as well and them, post the release of the third movie, drop a show in the five to ten years afterwards focused on the actual downfall of the Empire and the rebirth of the Republic. Actually, do it with a few shows. Have one be a Jedi focused show around Luke trying to rebuild the order and track down/deal with the Inquisitors. Have another be a political thriller focused on Leia and Mon Mothma establishing a government/dealing with the politics with Han as Leia's love interest and the dirty tricks man (probably with Lando involved as well).

Those two shows are kept separate but kinda like the MCU Netflix shows where they are in the same universe and do interact with one another.

Might also throw the Mandalorian is there as well. Have it taking place maybe five years post Endor at the most. Boba Fett could also work in the same time period.

Keep Jedi numbers down, probably have Ashoka as one of the leads of the Jedi show and be the one who really rounds out Lukes training. Make it so that Force Sensitives with enough power to theoretically be a Jedi are rare; as in a million or so in the entire galaxy. Most also need to start training young, those able to come to the Force late in life and excel being even rarer. The Force is also something best taught one on one and the new Jedi only have a handful of potential teachers and you are generally looking at twenty years to get someone properly qualified to be a Knight (and closer to forty for a proper master, on average).

If the Sequel Trilogy is still supposed to be at least basically similar to what we got then have Ben kidnapped as a baby/young kid in the Leia/Han focused show. Drop a few hints setting up the ST more broadly as well.

I would tie back into the Prequels and all the CIS droid run infrastructure as the basis for the Final Order. Palpatine kept copies of all of the Empires technical plans and R&D squirrelled away out there and starts rebuilding.

Have Rey be a project from one of Palpatine's cloner's in the immediate aftermath of Endor and before Palpatine's spirit could make its way to his fallback point and reconstitute himself. The cloner swipes a genetic sample and gets herself pregnant with "Palpatine's Son" in an attempt to claim the throne, fleeing out into the galaxy. Only she dies in childbirth and Rey ends up misplaced on some backwater for whatever reason.

Rey taps into the Force instinctively for whatever reason. Probably the Dark Side to save her life and this alerts Palpatine to her existence and he orders his agents to recover her. Cue the first movie. Probably have Rey flee to the Jedi and maybe a reunion between Ben and his family as he chases her down.

Palpatine realizes that secrecy is over and unleashes his fleet. It's Clone Wars 2.0 except Palpatine has the Clones and Droids on the same side.

Have the second movie be Luke, Ben, and Rey using Ben's knowledge to try and resolve the problem while Leia is being being the head of the Republic and fighting a major war. Maybe with the Republic allied with some Imperial Remnants who really don't want Palpatine back.

The second movie ends with Luke dying doing something suitably epic and saving Rey and Ben's lives. Maybe fighting Snoke before proving that "size matters not" and telekinetically holding an entire fleet in place so that they can escape before crushing the whole fleet? Or perhaps saving a world by simply tanking a superlaser shot (don't you know, the power of the Death Star is insignificant next to the power of the Force).

Have the third movie end with Ben eating Palpatine's spirit and them becoming one with the Light side of the Force, utterly eradicating the black soul. Probably with Rey pregnant with his kid. Maybe have Ben fight Palpatine for control and Palpatine keeps drawing on more and more of the Dark Side with Rey calling up the Light side spirits to oppose him and channeling that power into Ben?

Regardless, the movie ends with Palpatine quite thoroughly dead, the Sith properly eradicated (until someone finds a holocron or Force ghost or whatever), and the torch having been passed to a new generation.

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Regardless, plot the ST and the surrounding media before you do anything. Create a cohesive story for the galaxy going forward to whatever time you want the ST set in and figure out how to get from Endor to the ST time period in a manner that makes sense and with the "lesser" media telling the story. Ideally also leaving enough space for smaller expanded universe content in the time period in between.

I probably also would have paired it with another SWTOR type game except its set in the immediate post Endor aftermath. Use that to really tell the Warlords story, the collapse of the Empire, and the formation of the various successor states (with the Republic being basically first among equals).

Thrawn would be an interesting story to tell, but I don't think it would work as a movie or even really as a TV show. Probably do that as a video game somewhat in the vein of Mass Effect except with you playing a kind of Kyle Katarn role as a smuggler who can work with/help either/both sides. With the "canonical" ending being the Thrawn loses ending.

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If you want future media projects after that, go back to the Old Republic and tell the story of Revan. Have the initial three movies be the Mandalorian Wars. Movie one starts with him breaking with the Council and going off to join the war. Use it to build up the characters and mostly have it as an action movie with massive battle scenes and Revan (and friends) proving himself the military genius and leader he became known as. Have the movie end with him being given Supreme Command of the Republic military.

The second movie is where you start to see Revan's path to the Dark Side as military duty conflicts with what the Light side is all about. Orbital bombardment, necessary sacrifices, collateral damage, etc. Revan learns war with the Mandalorians as his teachers and the battlefield as his school. The movie ends with the Mass Shadow Generator being conceptualized.

The third movie (with some time skip) is the movie of the final campaigns. Revan deceives a large portion of the Mandalorian fleet into Malachor with Meetra in command and Revan & Malak leading a commando strike on Mandalore the Ultimate's ship. Revan kills him in single combat and rips knowledge of the Sith Empire from his head.

The second series of Revan movies starts with him returning from the Unknown Regions as a Sith and tracking down the Star Forge. It ends with Revan's fleet departing from the Forge to start his war. Kreia and the Triumvirate are also brought in.

The second movie is Revan's campaign, culminating in Bastila capturing him.

The third movie is Revan's redemption. When the Jedi try to wipe his mind, they instead wipe out the compulsions that the Sith Emperor planted in his head and Revan just pretends the wipe to have been successful (chiefly to avoid having to retread the Star Maps). Bastila is kidnapped and Revan tracks down Meetra and some of his old companions, probably meeting up with her right before she goes after Nihilus, and recruits them. The assault on the Star Forge happens with Meetra taking on Scion while Revan and Bastila (freed from Malaks brainwashing) are engaged with Kreia. Meetra joins up with them and it becomes a Meetra & Bastila vs. Kreia fight while Revan goes off to kill Malak.

The third movie ends with Revan, Meetra, and some of the crew heading off to the Sith Empire. Bastila left behind because she is pregnant and to prepare (along with Carth and Canderous) for the war to come.

The last three movies are that war. The first one is an infiltration of the Sith Empire. Done more as a "spy" movie with Revan's party setting the lesser Sith at one another to buy time, destabilize the Sith Empire, and get into a position where they can make a go at the Emperor himself. It ends with Revan triggering the Sith/Republic war by deceiving a Sith into ramming a major Imperial fleet into a prepared Republic fleet that has Bastila and her battle meditation in it.

The second movie follows an advancing Republic fleet under the command of Carth and Bastila (and being fed intelligence by Revan via his bond with Bastila) moving on the Empire while also following Revan preparing his strike.

The third movie ends with Revan ordering Bastila to glass Dromund Kaas while he and his party keep the Emperor locked down. Meetra's Force Wound nature protecting the party from whatever powers of the Emperor allowed him to easily beat Revan last time around. This victory, the entire campaign really, was incredibly costly to a still recovering Republic and while it ends with the Sith capital glassed, the Emperor dead, and a lot of the Sith fleet wrecked the Republic isn't in a position to push for total victory.

The Revan series of movies is supposed to have a very different feel to the originals. They are supposed to be full blown SW war movies at the height of the Jedi and Sith. Galaxy spanning war between peer competitors show in all its horror and glory. The Force unleashed in a way that the Skywalker story never really allowed for. I'm thinking a scene in the Revan's Sith Campaign movie where he unleashes Nihilus on a heavily populated world, reads everyone's minds to find who will be a problem, and then uses Nihilus to life rip all of the offenders from orbit before moving on. Or where Scion is atomised, only for his body to reform in a swirl of dust with him laughing as he walks out of a crater caused by an orbital strike.

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Those would have been my SW plans if I had Disney resources and acquired SW.
 

ShadowArxxy

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Comrade
When he was making the OT (and still expecting to make sequels down the line), Lucas explicitly said he wanted to make them "around 2000". So you're spot-on with "15 years too late".

It's difficult to pin down because Lucas has so repeatedly and explicitly contradicted himself in describing what he "planned all along". I don't know why he does this, but it's very clear that he pretty heavily retcons everything he says based on whatever his current "vision" may be. It's *very* clear that regardless of anything Lucas later claimed about having a multi-sequel arc planned "all along", the original Star Wars was written and delivered as a single standalone film. No one had *any* idea it was going to have the popularity it had, and Lucas' "all along" plans for a bigger story were -- at most -- vague and rough ideas for how he might recycle unused elements from more expansive early drafts of the story into sequels.

You then have Splinter of the Mind's Eye, which was quite explicitly written as a minimum-budget, minimum-risk sequel to the original Star Wars. While it was never outright retconned or removed from continuity, it diverges sharply from all other Star Wars content in several major plot points. In particular, because of its minimum-budget setup, Han Solo becomes "Sir Not Appearing In This Story", causing the Luke-Leia-Han love triangle from ANH to become definitely settled with a clear romantic relationship between Luke and Leia.

Splinter of the Mind's Eye quite clearly refutes any claim by Lucas that he had a six-movie or nine-movie meta-arc in mind from the beginning. Rather, the grandest "version" of Star Wars, the nine-movie "trilogy of trilogies", came about in the heady days after he got the green light to abandon Splinter of the Mind's Eye in favor of the big-budget Empire Strikes Back, but was then cut down to six movies and then three movies due to the exhaustion and personal issues that came as he realized just how much more work a lavish spectacle like TESB was even when he wasn't personally directing it.
 

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