Israel versus Palestine: 2021 Edition

Zachowon said:
Iirc someone posted that the US validated thier story
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Secretary of State came out and said he saw no evidence.

Bear Ribs said:
IT was verified years ago by a former AP press member that the AP press was working with Hamas and reporters who didn't toe the line and report Hamas' story got killed. Consequently it's pretty much impossible to get evidence outside of the IDF, you're literally asking for either Hamas or people Hamas is holding at gunpoint to corroborate with Israel.

www.theatlantic.com

What the Media Gets Wrong About Israel

The news tells us less about Israel than about the people writing the news, a former AP reporter says.
www.theatlantic.com www.theatlantic.com
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That article only mentions AP twice and says nothing about them working with Hamas. For context:
The event took place a short drive from the homes and offices of the hundreds of international journalists who are based in Jerusalem. Journalists were aware of it: The sizable Jerusalem bureau of the Associated Press, for example, which can produce several stories on an average day, was in possession of photos of the event, including the one above, a day later. (The photographs were taken by someone I know who was on campus that day, and I sent them to the bureau myself.) Jerusalem editors decided that the images, and the rally, were not newsworthy, and the demonstration was only mentioned by the AP weeks later when the organization’s Boston bureau reported that Brandeis University had cut ties with Al-Quds over the incident. On the day that the AP decided to ignore the rally, November 6, 2013, the same bureau published a report about a pledge from the U.S. State Department to provide a minor funding increase for the Palestinian Authority; that was newsworthy. This is standard. To offer another illustration, the construction of 100 apartments in a Jewish settlement is always news; the smuggling of 100 rockets into Gaza by Hamas is, with rare exceptions, not news at all.
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History Learner said:
Secretary of State came out and said he saw no evidence.



That article only mentions AP twice and says nothing about them working with Hamas. For context:
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You've got to be kidding. A brief search reveals over fifty mentions in the article, by an AP reporter, about the AP and it's working with Hamas.

Jerusalem editors decided that the images, and the rally, were not newsworthy, and the demonstration was only mentioned by the AP weeks later when the organization’s Boston bureau reported that Brandeis University had cut ties with Al-Quds over the incident. On the day that the AP decided to ignore the rally, November 6, 2013, the same bureau published a report about a pledge from the U.S. State Department to provide a minor funding increase for the Palestinian Authority; that was newsworthy. This is standard. To offer another illustration, the construction of 100 apartments in a Jewish settlement is always news; the smuggling of 100 rockets into Gaza by Hamas is, with rare exceptions, not news at all.
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During my time at the AP, we helped Hamas get this point across with a school of reporting that might be classified as “Surprising Signs of Moderation” (a direct precursor to the “Muslim Brotherhood Is Actually Liberal” school that enjoyed a brief vogue in Egypt). In one of my favorite stories, “More Tolerant Hamas” (December 11, 2011), reporters quoted a Hamas spokesman informing readers that the movement’s policy was that “we are not going to dictate anything to anyone,” and another Hamas leader saying the movement had “learned it needs to be more tolerant of others.” Around the same time, I was informed by the bureau’s senior editors that our Palestinian reporter in Gaza couldn’t possibly provide critical coverage of Hamas because doing so would put him in danger.
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I gave in my first essay about the suppression by the AP’s Jerusalem bureau of a report about an Israeli peace offer to the Palestinians in 2008, or the decision to ignore the rally at Al-Quds University, or the idea that Hamas’s development of extensive armament works in Gaza in recent years was not worth serious coverage despite objectively being one of the most important storylines demanding reporters’ attention.
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More than that and I'll start copyright infringing from so much. Would you care to retract your claim about only two mentions and no mention of working with Hamas?
 
Bear Ribs said:
You've got to be kidding. A brief search reveals over fifty mentions in the article, by an AP reporter, about the AP and it's working with Hamas.
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My apologies, I searched for "Associated Press" rather than AP.

More than that and I'll start copyright infringing from so much. Would you care to retract your claim about only two mentions and no mention of working with Hamas?
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For the former, yes, for the latter no because nothing you have cited shows any sort of direct connection as claimed even if it is taken at face value. There is a very, very big leap from "AP didn't report this story about a 2008 peace offer from Israel" to "AP is working with Hamas directly".
 
History Learner said:
My apologies, I searched for "Associated Press" rather than AP.


For the former, yes, for the latter no because nothing you have cited shows any sort of direct connection as claimed even if it is taken at face value. There is a very, very big leap from "AP didn't report this story about a 2008 peace offer from Israel" to "AP is working with Hamas directly".
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I rather question your reading comprehension in that case, though as you apparently didn't read the article but instead did a search for a few specific words, I should perhaps instead question how you are qualified to say "nothing I cited shows X," especially when the bulk of the article is about X.

From the article:

During my time at the AP, we helped Hamas get this point across with a school of reporting that might be classified as “Surprising Signs of Moderation” (a direct precursor to the “Muslim Brotherhood Is Actually Liberal” school that enjoyed a brief vogue in Egypt
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One of the reasons it works is because of the reflex I mentioned. If you report that Hamas has a strategy based on co-opting the media, this raises several difficult questions, like, What exactly is the relationship between the media and Hamas? And has this relationship corrupted the media?
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Cameramen waiting outside Shifa Hospital in Gaza City would film the arrival of civilian casualties and then, at a signal from an official, turn off their cameras when wounded and dead fighters came in, helping Hamas maintain the illusion that only civilians were dying. (This too happened; the information comes from multiple sources with firsthand knowledge of these incidents.)
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Hamas fighters would burst into the AP’s Gaza bureau and threaten the staff—and the AP wouldn’t report it. (This also happened.)
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Cameramen waiting outside Shifa Hospital in Gaza City would film the arrival of civilian casualties and then, at a signal from an official, turn off their cameras when wounded and dead fighters came in, helping Hamas maintain the illusion that only civilians were dying. (This too happened; the information comes from multiple sources with firsthand knowledge of these incidents.)
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Colford, the AP spokesman, confirmed that armed militants entered the AP’s Gaza office in the early days of the war to complain about a photo showing the location of a rocket launch,
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Random Username said:


@GoldRanger what's it like there now?
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Much, much quieter than at the beginning. They haven't launched to central Israel in days. The south is still being pummeled, but it's also been awhile since they managed to penetrate the Iron Dome protection.

It sounds like they're preparing their people for an end to hostilities (making up excuses why it's OK to stop now even though they're getting pummeled), but from Israel's POV calling this a Hamas victory is laughable.

To be honest the Israeli media is already gradually shifting to talk about the internal Arab riots, since there's a general feeling that Gaza is under control.
 
I think this is the start. Just lets see what Iran plans to do.
 
Zachowon said:
I think this is the start. Just lets see what Iran plans to do.
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Currently it looks like Hezbollah is deterred. I think Iran is manipulating the Palestinians to start a third Intifada (currently it looks like things are headed that way, hopefully I'm wrong). I don't expect a direct confrontation with Hezbollah, Iran or another Shiite proxy in this rounds of fighting. A few months from now? Who knows, everything's possible in the Middle East.
 
GoldRanger said:
Currently it looks like Hezbollah is deterred. I think Iran is manipulating the Palestinians to start a third Intifada (currently it looks like things are headed that way, hopefully I'm wrong). I don't expect a direct confrontation with Hezbollah, Iran or another Shiite proxy in this rounds of fighting. A few months from now? Who knows, everything's possible in the Middle East.
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We are watching with nail biting suspense wondering if Iran is going to try anything
 
GoldRanger said:
Spoiler: not directly, no. Only going to manipulate factions to rouse internal dissent. I don't think America is getting dragged into this business, would be stunned if it does end up that way.
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This is Iran we are talking about.
With who is POTUS right now? They may go for it more then normal
 
Husky_Khan said:
Cease fire has been signed! As expected it's a total and complete Hamas Victory.



With this series of unmitigated successes I doubt this Peace can last very long before they give it another go and follow up their string of victories.
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Back to the status quo?
 
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