China Wuhan Virus Pandemic

Emperor Tippy

Merchant of Death
Super Moderator
Staff Member
Founder
To be clear, is "This is all nonsense conspiracy theories thread full of hair on fire crazy panic" Your personal stance or an official moderator position?
The information is being provided because of the pointless crazy panic. People are free to express whatever opinions they want and the staff, as such, don't have an official position beyond "this thread is fucking annoying".

Even if we did, you are generally free to ignore official TS positions and we don't care (with caveats regarding rules enforcement and the like).
 

Abhorsen

Local Degenerate
Moderator
Staff Member
Comrade
Osaul
... is a very sane and normal reaction to a disease that infected only 50,000-something people and killed 1000ish by that point. :unsure:
The CCP isn't exactly rational, though. Given the response to the last time (SARS), where they didn't do enough, this time they are putting on a show about how much they are doing. Remember, the CCP doesn't care about people, just about its image and economy. So it's forcing people back to work before it is safe while at the same time having an authoritarian crackdown on people with the virus.
 

Harlock

I should have expected that really
The Chinese aren't simply fighting a virus, they are also using this as an excuse to lock up dissidents under the name of quarantine and tighten their grip on power. There have been a number of outspoken critics of the government who vanished and are listed as being in medical custody.
Xi himself is quoted as saying it is proof China needs more centralisation and direct control from the top to avoid a similar crisis. The fact he has been tightening control for years and using any excuse to become more authoritarian is highly convenient.

So no, don't trust China, but don't assume this virus is the only thing at play and be aware there is more than one agenda at work. At the base of it all is Xi using this to cement his position as Premier and further consolidate power in his hands by removing opponents and cracking down on private communications.
 

Abhorsen

Local Degenerate
Moderator
Staff Member
Comrade
Osaul
That’s exactly my point. Why would they irreparably harm their image and economy over a disease that was causing a mere 30 to 50 deaths a day?
I don't think you get it. The CCP view their response of authoritarianism thru quarantine as a good image to show the world. Basically, it says: "Look, we learned our lesson from SARS, look how much stuff we are doing to stop this." The quarantine is GOOD press for China.
 

Bacle

When the effort is no longer profitable...
Founder
The Chinese aren't simply fighting a virus, they are also using this as an excuse to lock up dissidents under the name of quarantine and tighten their grip on power. There have been a number of outspoken critics of the government who vanished and are listed as being in medical custody.
Xi himself is quoted as saying it is proof China needs more centralisation and direct control from the top to avoid a similar crisis. The fact he has been tightening control for years and using any excuse to become more authoritarian is highly convenient.

So no, don't trust China, but don't assume this virus is the only thing at play and be aware there is more than one agenda at work. At the base of it all is Xi using this to cement his position as Premier and further consolidate power in his hands by removing opponents and cracking down on private communications.
And if the problem was contained to China, then it wouldn't be a big issue.

But it isn't. Iran is looking pretty bad. Japan and SK have some issues cropping up. Italy is facing problems as well last I heard. Brazil has some as well. Plus now NYC has unsourced cases.

Per the WHO, the flu has a death rate of about 1%; Covid19 has a base mortality rate of 3%. And this is a lowball estimate, using the CCP's numbers.

I'd prefer to overestimate, rather than underestimate, given how dangerous this bug could be in the long term due to SARS-like fertility issues in survivors.
 

Duke Nukem

Hail to the king baby
We may be acting irrationally, but I like to hope for the best and prepare for the worst in these types of situations.
 

Harlock

I should have expected that really
My personal view is to take precautions but I don't trust either extreme. There's arguments to be made for either analysis but no undisputed facts. I think China is underselling the figures, but I also think a lot of their response is Communist theatre and a deliberate show of power rather than a measured reaction. Same can be true of Iran.

Beside that, beside questions of general health variances between countries, between mild cases not being reported as people just tank it and the fact the seasons are changing I'll wait before making a judgement. We'll eventually get solid peer reviewed figures from credible sources found using good methods and sample sizes.

I'm still stocking up on Pasta and medical alcohol of course :p But aside from basic precautions I'm not altering my routine just yet.
 

Shipmaster Sane

You have been weighed
The information is being provided because of the pointless crazy panic. People are free to express whatever opinions they want and the staff, as such, don't have an official position beyond "this thread is fucking annoying".

Even if we did, you are generally free to ignore official TS positions and we don't care (with caveats regarding rules enforcement and the like).
Interesting that staff opinions carry official mod colors, I'd think that Boot would be free and welcome to post his opinions and whatever information he found interesting like a normal poster.
 

Harlock

I should have expected that really
It isn't a neurological pathogen, it also isn't a revelation. The studies into coronovirus moving through the central nervous system into the brains of mice was conducted in 1990 :p

All virus' have the potential for transmission to the brain, this is known as encephalomyelitis
and is a swelling of the brain and spinal cord. It can be caused by coronovirus (Of all types, not just this new one) and by more common virus including regular influenza, measles, rubella, basically any virus you can catch is a potential neurological disease.

So before you panic, determine the numbers and figure out if it is uncommonly high when compared to standard encephalomyelitis cases which have existed as a complication of viral infection since forever.
 

Lord Sovereign

Well-known member
This is true, however, this virus seems to be able to migrate into - and deeply infiltrate - organs and tissues more rapidly and invasively than other viruses do, leading to a greater prevalence of neurological symptoms. That's the part that worries me.

Whilst being more rapid and invasive than other viruses, I'd still presume it's unlikely to cause those neurological symptoms? That aside, can anything be done for people suffering from such symptoms?
 

Harlock

I should have expected that really
The symptoms manifest similarly to MS, you are basically talking about the inflammation of the spinal cord disrupting signals from the brain to different parts of the body. Encephalomyelitis can be treated and a majority of patients recover, but there can be long term issues to varying degrees and there is no full restoration cure.
Fortunately the effects are far less for these type of virus' than for something like Zika (Remember that from a few years back?) which causes major long term Neuro issues, or even worse Ebola which if it doesn't kill you does seriously ruin your nervous system in many cases.

So check the numbers. This sort of thing is to be expected with any viral outbreak, don't get too worried unless it is shown to be unusually common or severe.
 

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